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While the statue artist has cleared the statue for unveiling—see below “street test”— Derrick has requested that it not be on display until he knows, in his mind, that it’s ready.

Putting Lebron’s Legendary Title Run into Its Proper Context

Right as the Heat’s playoff run was taking place I knew it could be something special in the making but putting a set of performances into context right after the fact is risky.  People tend to overrate anything in the heat of the moment and I was cautious about putting this run with the best ever even after Lebron won a title.  But now when the dust has settled and I have seen some of the numbers and recollected my thoughts, there is overwhelming evidence that this title run is indeed one of the greatest of all time with an actual case for #1!



Aspects of Lebron's '12 run analyzed in this article are:

1) Statistical Dominance
2) Defense
3) Finals Performance
4) Legendary Moments
5) Impact and Contribution to Wins
6) Difficulty of the Run/Adversity
7) Intangibles
8) Regular Season


1) Statistical Dominance

Let’s first take a look at the best scoring performances only.  People usually don’t consider Lebron to be an elite scorer so surely he isn’t expected to set any records here.


Top 10 Scoring Averages in a Title Run with Scoring Efficiency

• ’93 Michael Jordan – 35.05 ppg on 47.5 %FG/55.3 %TS
  
• ’92 Michael Jordan – 34.50 ppg on 49.9 %FG/57.1 %TS
  
• ’95 Hakeem Olajuwon – 32.95 ppg on 53.1 %FG/56.0 %TS
  
• ’98 Michael Jordan – 32.38 ppg on 46.2 %FG/54.5 %TS
  
• ’80 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar – 31.93 ppg on 57.2 %FG/61.1 %TS
  
• ’91 Michael Jordan – 31.12 ppg on 52.4 %FG/60.0 %TS
  
• ’97 Michael Jordan – 31.05 ppg on 45.6 %FG/52.4 %TS
  
• ’00 Shaquille O’Neal – 30.74 ppg on 56.6 %FG/55.6 %TS
  
• ’96 Michael Jordan – 30.67 ppg on 45.9 %FG/56.4 %TS
  
• ’01 Shaquille O’Neal – 30.44 ppg on 55.5 %FG/56.4 %TS
  
• ’12 Lebron James – 30.30 ppg on 50.0 %FG/57.6 %TS

Lebron’s run is 11^th all time in PPG.  Only Jordan, Shaq, and Kareem, and Hakeem have bested Lebron’s scoring rate this postseason.  In terms of FG% on this list, Lebron is middle of the pack - 6^th.   Jordan only has one postseason where he shot better and the rest are top centers…  In terms of TS%, Lebron is 3^rd on the list behind only Jordan’s and Kareem’s best runs.  Even looking at just scoring Lebron’s run is among the best ever.

Now let’s look at all-around dominance.  PER isn’t a perfect stat but it can give us a rough idea of how great a player is in contributing in many different ways statistically.


Top 10 PER Averages in a Title Run

1.   ’91 Michael Jordan – 32.0

2.   ’00 Shaquille O’Neal – 30.45

3.   ’12 Lebron James – 30.34

4.   ’93 Michael Jordan – 30.06

5.   ’01 Shaquille O’Neal – 28.67

6.   ’03 Tim Duncan – 28.42

7.   ’02 Shaquille O’Neal – 28.27

8.   ’98 Michael Jordan – 28.06

9.   ’80 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar – 27.91

10.   ’94 Hakeem Olajuwon – 27.69


Lebron is 3^rd all-time behind peak Jordan and peak Shaq and there is a big drop-off after the top 4.  Now if all the stats were recorded throughout NBA history, some past legends would almost certainly be high on this list and maybe Wilt in ’67 and Kareem in ’71 would surpass Lebron in PER.  Maybe…  But his run is still almost unmatched.

Let’s now take a look at Lebron’s complete numbers in the ’12 playoffs:

30.3 ppg, 9.7 rpg, 5.7 apg, 1.9 spg on 50.0 %FG/57.6 %TS with 3.5 topg in 42.7 mpg

The other players in history to put up more over 30 ppg, over 9 rpg, and over 5 apg in a title run?  NOBODY! No player in NBA history has ever done it!  Let alone on 50% shooting from the floor…

He finished the ’12 postseason as the league leader in PPG, Points, Rebounds, Offensive Rebounds, Field Goals Made, Free Throws Made, Minutes Played, PER and finished second in Assists and Steals.  That’s unprecedented dominance over the league he played in!  It’s not like he was "Oscar" but there were "Wilts" and "Baylors" out there.  Lebron is far ahead of the competition.  


2) Defense

As if Lebron’s offensive dominance wasn’t enough, he was a complete wrecking ball on the defensive end as well in this playoff run.  He has become a great man defender and Carmelo Anthony and Paul Pierce have both struggled mightily shooting against James.  Spoelstra was somewhat hesitant to put LBJ on Durant in fear of fatigue and foul trouble but in the 4^th quarters of games, Lebron has been effective in slowing KD down.  Let’s look at some detailed numbers.

Carmelo in this postseason averaged 27.8 ppg and 2.2 apg on 41.9% shooting.  With Lebron on him (Battier defended him for long periods), Carmelo shot just 12-41 (29.3%) from the floor.  He was forced to shoot farther away from the rim and Lebron’s length bothered his jumpshot.  He struggled to get those easy feeds in the post that he thrives on.

Granger against Miami averaged 13.3 ppg and 3.0 apg on 37.7% shooting.  I don’t have Lebron-only stats and Battier spent significant time on Danny but it’s safe to say that Granger didn’t do very well with Lebron on him.

Pierce was covered by Lebron much of the ECF series with Battier on Allen and Wade on Rondo.  Pierce averaged 18.0 ppg and 2.3 apg on a paltry 34.4% from the field and just 26.3% from 3pt land.  Apart from Game 5 when he was great and got the last laugh with that clutch jumper in Lebron’s grill, the Truth was shut down by the King!!

Even when Lebron gets beat off the dribble he has become great at funneling the slasher to the baseline or to his bigs forcing him into a difficult shot.  It’s hard to count the number of times Durant got rejected by Bosh or Wade at the rim.   It’s the little things that don’t show up on the stat sheet.

We also know that Lebron’s defense goes far beyond man-to-man defense.  He is a brilliant help defender and a pseudo-post presence on this Miami Heat squad.  He doubles hard and recovers very quickly.  Few defenders could cover the court like Lebron.  Of course he is also a beast at playing the passing lanes and racking up steals which usually lead to easy fast break dunks.


3) Finals Performance

Here are Lebron’s complete Finals numbers:

28.6 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 7.4 apg, 1.6 spg on 47.2 %FG/55.8 %TS with 3.8 topg in 44.0 mpg

Much like with his playoff numbers, no player in history has ever done this in a Finals series!!  The closest attempts at all-around dominance came from Bird’s 24.0/9.7/9.5 in the ’86 Finals, Magic’s 26.2/8.0/13.0 in the ’87 Finals and Jordan’s 31.2/6.6/11.4 in the ’91 Finals.   Pretty fine company…

He faced a tough hard-nosed defender in Thabo Sefolosha and occasionally the long and athletic Kevin Durant but nobody could put a dent on Lebron James.  After torching the Thunder on drives and from the post the first three games, they decided to double him.  That’s when he put on a Magic Johnson impersonation with 25 assists in the last 2 games and the Thunder didn’t know what hit them.  Battier, Chalmers, Miller, Cole etc buried OKC in a barrage of 3pt shots.


4) Legendary Moments

Lebron James has had 3 memorable moments in this postseason that will last the test of time.  Every truly great run must have some of these special special moments that even fans and players of the other team will just say “Wow, there is nothing wrong in getting beat by a guy this good!”.

Moment #1: The Indianapolis 500 Ways to Dominate  



Indiana had romped the Heat in Game 3 and taken a 2-1 series lead.  Bosh was injured and pronounced WNP for the rest of the series.  Wade had his knee drained and looked weaker than ever.  The Heat were on the ropes.  Lebron James came out and hung up 40/18/9 in the Conseco Fieldhouse single-handedly shifting the momentum in the series.  His domination on the boards (6 offensive rebounds) and determination to get the struggling Wade back in the groove are the most stunning aspects of this one. The only other player to put up that kind of a statline in a postseason game is Elgin Baylor in 1961.  For those counting, that’s over 50 years ago!! And at a pace 30-40% higher than today’s.  Imagine if Lebron played 60 minutes in that game which would correct for the pace difference… but I digress.

Moment #2: Massacre at the Boston Garden



In Game 5, Pierce hit a 3pt dagger in Lebron’s face, strutted his way off court and the Celtics left Miami with a 3-2 series lead going back to Boston.  The Heat had virtually no hope.  “Well there is always next year…” Lebron came out before the next game with that death stare look.  Nobody could stop him, nobody could come in his way… He exploded with a 45/15/5 game on 19/26 (73%) shooting.  He hit unbelievable shots one after the other.  From the post, from the perimeter, turnarounds, fadeaways, drives to the basket… He did everything he wanted and the NBA’s best defense was powerless to stop him!  After that performance James is officially the reincarnation of Andrew Toney “the Boston straggler”.  That was vicious, cruel, and unfair if you are a Celtic fan.  The Heat went on to win Game 7 and the series.  The only player in postseason history to have these numbers in a game is Wilt Chamberlain in 1964.  48 years ago and at a blinding-quick pace.  How’s that for some perspective?

Moment #3: The Cramp Game



While being by far the least impressive of the three performances, this one will stay in people’s memory for three reasons.  Lebron got hit by cramps late in Game 4 after falling awkwardly, it was in the Finals in a pivotal game, and he hit a huge 3pt shot while hobbling to put the game and series out of reach.  He asked to come back on the floor scored and made some plays then had to exit again in excruciating pain.  It was a demonstration of sheer will.  


5) Impact and Contribution to Wins

His stats are nice, he played awesome defense, and he had a few great moments but what was his impact on the team?  Is there a correlation between his play and his team winning basketball games?  Playing better in the Finals certainly meant a lot.  They beat a superior team to the one they lost to the previous year.  But let’s provide some proof.

Let’s look at some Win Shares records in postseason history.  Like PER it’s not a perfect stat and it tends to underrate players prior to ’78 when not all stats were recorded (different formula is used) and fewer playoff games were played but it’s still very informative.


Top 10 Win Shares in a Title Run

• ’03 Tim Duncan – 5.94
  
• ’12 Lebron James – 5.82
  
• ’98 Michael Jordan – 4.81
  
• ’06 Dwyane Wade – 4.79
  
• ’91 Michael Jordan – 4.77
  
• ’84 Larry Bird – 4.72
  
• ’96 Michael Jordan – 4.68
  
• ’00 Shaquille O’Neal – 4.67
  
• ’09 Kobe Bryant – 4.66
  
• ’93 Michael Jordan – 4.40

He’s #2 behind only Tim Duncan at his peak and there is big drop-off after that.  Seeing these numbers I suspected that much of Timmy’s impact came on defense so I wanted to look at just Offensive Win Shares.


Top 10 Offensive Win Shares in a Title Run

• ’12 Lebron James – 4.21
  
• ’98 Michael Jordan – 3.63
  
• ’00 Shaquille O’Neal – 3.59
  
• ’96 Michael Jordan – 3.36
  
• ’93 Michael Jordan – 3.34
  
• ’03 Tim Duncan – 3.27
  
• ’09 Kobe Bryant – 3.26
  
• ’91 Michael Jordan – 3.23
  
• ’10 Pau Gasol – 3.18
  
• ’88 Magic Johnson – 3.18

Lebron is #1 and far ahead of second place Michael Jordan.  On top of showing impact, Win Shares also do a fine job of indirectly showing the dependence of a team on that one particular player?  The higher the load on a particular player, the larger his apparent impact will be.  Could that mean Lebron was a ball-hog then and simply wasn’t letting his teammates get a chance at having the ball and impacting the game?


Top 10 Usage Rates in a Title Run

• ’93 Michael Jordan – 38.03%
  
• ’92 Michael Jordan – 37.09%
  
• ’98 Michael Jordan – 36.59%
  
• ’95 Hakeem Olajuwon – 35.86%
  
• ’97 Michael Jordan – 35.53%
  
• ’12 Lebron James – 33.39%
  
• ’10 Kobe Bryant – 33.19%
  
• ’09 Kobe Bryant – 32.95%
  
• ’96 Michael Jordan – 32.88%
  
• ’91 Micheal Jordan – 32.69%

Well he’s #6 in usage rate and below many other top runs. There is no doubt his team tremendously depended on him with Wade hobbled and Bosh out for so long.  Lebron led his own team in points, rebounds, assists, and steals in the playoffs.  However, judging by his high assist numbers and moderate USG% considering the production, he was certainly using his teammates effectively.  He had three runs with the Cavs where his usage rate was higher.

Yet another way to assess Lebron’s impact is to look at postseason +/-, which basically shows the point differential for his team when he is on the floor.  Lebron is far and way the league leader at +199 which is not surprising.  Per game that equates to +8.65 meaning that over the 43 minutes that he plays in a game his team on average outscores the other by almost 9 points!  Miami’s margin of victory or point differential in the postseason is +173 or +7.52 point per game.  Over 48 min, Lebron’s team wins by 9.72 points when he’s in the game and loses by 1.27 points when he’s out of the game.   James quite clearly makes his team much better when he’s on the court.


6) Difficulty of the Run/Adversity

The Heat’s run to the title this year was extraordinarily difficult.  Who would have put the money on the Heat winning the title down 2-1 to the Pacers with Bosh out for the series and Wade having serious knee troubles?  Who would bet on the Heat winning it all down 3-2 going back to Boston?

Injuries have decimated this team.  Bosh went down in Game 1 of the Pacers series and came back in Game 5 of the Boston series missing 10 straight games.  And he was never 100% and struggled to find his rhythm for the first few games.  When your only big capable of producing offensively is down and out, it’s hard to stay above water.  Wade struggled with his knees almost throughout and hasn’t looked like his normal self except the last three games of the Pacers series immediately after his knee was drained.  Dwyane put up 22.8/5.2/4.3 on 46.2% shooting in the postseason, solid numbers for a second option but nothing extraordinary.

Extrapolating the record of their opponents to a full 82-game season, the teams the Heat beat in the postseason this year had won 45 games (Knicks), 52 games (Pacers), 49 games (Boston), and 58 games (OKC).  It’s worth noting that Boston was on pace to win 58 games after the All-Star break and were the hottest team in the NBA entering the playoffs.  In the Finals, the Heat had no home court advantage either and had to beat a young Thunder team that was more healthy and talented top to bottom.

Winning a title after trailing in 3 playoffs series (2-1 to Indy, 3-2 to Boston, and 1-0 to OKC) is a first.  No team has ever done it before.  Last but not least, no team and player have ever been put under such scrutiny before.  The pressure on Miami was enormous and it could have made them crack.  This team has shown tremendous resolve largely thanks to their leader Lebron James.


7) Intangibles

Bill Simmons might have been on to something when he said that Wade’s injury was necessary for the Heat to win the title.  A team cannot win with two alphas, two guys who want the ball at crunch time, two guys who all other players look up to.  Wade was limited by injury and was forced to relinquish that role to Lebron.  LBJ was thrust into the position of alpha, he adjusted quickly, and the rest is history.   A turning point occurred before Game 4 of the Indiana series and the process was complete in Game 6 of the Boston series.  At that point even the biggest Wade fans knew that this was Lebron’s team.

Lebron’s leadership in the playoff run was extraordinary.  His level of intensity in every game starting from Game 4 of the Pacers series is almost unheard of.  He didn’t have a single bad game.  That kind of sheer will and determination was seen in a handful of players in history… guys like Bill Russell, Larry Bird, Isiah Thomas, Michael Jordan, Kevin Garnett, and Kobe Bryant.  Lebron inspired that “play every game like it’s your last” mentality in his teammates.

James never let the enormous pressure get to him.  The year before he played to prove his critics wrong and sometimes played to his weaknesses.  The pressure to win overwhelmed him.  This year he played for himself and his team.  He went to his strengths.  Slashing ability, post moves, playmaking in the half court, and being a disruptor defensively.  Rarely did he settle for long-range jumpers.   And he delivered in the clutch in every series including the Finals.


8) Regular Season

As if the postseason run wasn’t enough, Lebron had a terrific regular season as well winning MVP and making 1^st Team All-NBA and 1^st Team All-Defense.  Here are the numbers:

27.1 ppg, 7.9 rpg, 6.2 apg, 1.9 spg on 53.1 %FG/60.5% TS with 3.4 topg in 37.5 mpg

The last perimeter player to shoot that high a percentage from the field? Michael Jordan in 88-89 shot 53.8% but the league shot an average of 47.8% back then compared to 44.9% now.

James also led the league in PER (30.7), Win Shares (14.5), and +/- (+474) by large margins and Miami Heat had the top SRS in the league before Lebron set out the last couple of games of the season.  And this is not even the best season Lebron has had, statistically or overall.


Final Thoughts

Ranking individual runs is somewhat subjective and I will eventually integrate this one into my earlier article on the Top15 Greatest Individual Title Runs of All-Time but it’s safe to say that Lebron this year put himself in some rarefied air in terms of great playoff performances.

References

Basketball-Reference

RealGM

hoopsdata

82games

NBA.com

Everyone seems to be making one of these lists lately so I might as well. I won’t bore you with statistics unless it’s truly something exceptional but I’ll give my own views on these top 25 players and where they fit on the ladder of greatness. All factors like peak, longevity, competition, strength of teams, player profile (completeness of game, strengths, weaknesses), and intangibles will be considered. But allow me to make a disclaimer. Accomplishments generally do take precedence over anything else. A player with a monster peak but nothing else to show for it like Bob McAdoo or Nate Archibald won’t sniff this list and might make the back-end of the top50. MIGHT! We’re not going off of potential. It’s the real thing.

Here’s a couple of guys that barely missed out on my list:

Rick Barry – monster scorer, possibly the best shooter ever with a good all-around offensive game but average defender, locker-room cancer and spent way too much of his prime in the ABA. He’s likely to give you 1 or 2 quality contending years but the rest of the time he’ll be undermining your team or going elsewhere to be coached by his uncle. No thanks. Sorry Rick!

Bill Walton – monster peak but his career was effectively 1.5 seasons long! He is maybe the greatest intangibles player ever (yes arguably #1!) on top of being one of the most complete bigs ever but the bottom line is, I’d rather have 10 years of say David Robinson than 1.5 of Bill Walton.

Walt Frazier – maybe the most underrated player in history. He was the engine behind those titles and he stepped up in big games for the Knicks. His prime was a little short and playing with Willis hurts his standing.

Jason Kidd – could never take games over offensively. Always an overrated player in my book, mediocre shooter, poor man’s John Stockton with a bit more board work.

Elvin Hayes – one of the best big men ever with a good long career but a locker-room cancer like Barry. Took way too many shots for most of his career, turnaround fadeaways no less! Lot of talent, little brains. If you’re looking to win titles, you wouldn’t want him.

Other HM: Dwyane Wade, Patrick Ewing, Bob Cousy, Willis Reed, George Gervin


#25 Isiah Thomas



Those who have him in their top20 are greatly overrating Thomas in my opinion but he does belong here at #25. While he did play on deep balanced Bay Boy teams where he wasn’t even the best player on the floor in many games and even series, he was the heart and soul of the team. His ability to take over a game with his scoring, his heart, his desire, his determination, his tenacity were unparalleled. Let me tell you, Celtics/Lakers/Bulls players and fans alike in the 80’s were scared of Isiah Thomas when he had the ball. The man scored 25 points in a quarter of a finals game in 88 which is the all-time record. Did I mention that he did that on a severely sprained ankle under immense pain! He was a wildly inconsistent player like most scoring guards but that is ok when there is enough talented players to take over while he’s quiet. When he went ham, it was game over 9 times out of 10 for the other team. It’s worth noting that while Isiah was definitely a score-first point guard, he was a very capable playmaker averaging 8-10 assists for most of his career. In I have a must win game, I want this guy on my team period. Perseverance and heart is what will define Isiah Lord Thomas III. The fact that he was never even a clear top10 player in the league or finished higher than 5th in MVP voting over the course of a season hurts his case for moving up further.

http://www.basketbal.../thomais01.html

#24 Dirk Nowitzki



The Big German. The greatest shooting big man ever. One of the greatest players of the past decade that is still humming along. In his prime despite playing on the perimeter, Dirk could rebound very well and he’s above average defensively. Obviously his greatest strength is scoring but where he really shines is taking games over offensively, especially in the 4^th quarter, and making clutch plays in the dying seconds when his teams need it most. 06 WCSF Game 7 against the Spurs last seconds of regulation and-1 that forces games into OT and leads to a Mavs win, 11 Finals Game 2 drive on Bosh and a game-winning lay-up in what was basically a must win game, 11 Finals Game 4 game-winning jumper and many more plays like that is what defines Dirk’s career. He’s a cold-blooded killer who you want in the game when it’s on the line. The reason why he cannot go higher on this list is that fact that he is a 7-footer that cannot defend the paint effectively. If I was building a franchise, I’d rather have a big that is a premier rebounder and defender than one who plays like a perimeter player. With Dirk, I need a defensive big beside him. It isn’t a coincidence the Mavs couldn’t win it all until Chandler came over! In a few years and a few more All-NBA selections and such, Dirk could squeak into the top20.

http://www.basketbal.../nowitdi01.html

#23 David Robinson



Maybe the best all-around big man ever! Tall, super athletic… the man could do everything on the floor. One of the best scorers, rebounders, passers, defenders at the C position ever. So what stops him from being higher on the ladder? Put simply, he just wasn’t meant to be an alpha player. He couldn’t take over games in the playoffs. He outplayed Hakeem in almost all of their H2H matchups in the regular season but when they met in the 95 WCF, Hakeem humiliated him. Despite his great resume and winning 2 titles as a #2 guy to Tim Duncan, Robinson will always be remembered as someone who just didn’t have the killer instinct, who folded and let others get the spotlight when the cards were on the table. His stint in the navy and a severe injury during the 96-97 season effectively cut his prime short as well. It’s too bad. He had the talent and the playing ability of a top10 player. EASILY!

http://www.basketbal.../robinda01.html

#22 Bob Pettit



Probably the most underrated player ever. 2-time MVP, 4-time all-star game MVP, 10-time All-NBA 1^st Team, NBA Champion (1958). He is the only player except Wilt Chamberlain ever to beat Bill Russell in the playoffs. Russell was a bit hobbled in that finals but still… he wasn’t 100% other times and people couldn’t touch him! Bob Pettit had a spectacular finals in 1958 averaging 29 ppg in the series and his game 6 is a stuff of legend. 50 points, 25 rebounds including 19 of the last 21 points of the game for his team. He was a 26, 16, and 3 player over his 11-year career and he led his team to 3 more NBA finals which they would lose to the Celtics. He was a dominant scorer and rebounder, an above average playmaker and defender. He faced weak competition though and had a really mediocre FG% so it’s hard to have him much higher.

http://www.basketbal.../pettibo01.html

#21 Lebron James



Now Lebron is just 27 years old but he already has all of the credentials of an NBA legend. Three MVP’s, a Finals MVP leading one of the greatest runs ever, two other finals appearances, six 1^st teams, four defensive 1^st teams, 2^nd all-time in PER and scoring. Arguably the best passing forward ever and a true fantasy league stud. Barring serious injury he is pretty much guaranteed to end up in what Bill Simmons calls the pantheon (top12) when it's all said and done even with no more titles. Sky is the limit for the King and he just has to continue to rack up MVP's of all types! He won his first title at a younger age than both Jordan and Shaq. As committed as he has been in the past year in improving his post-game as well as his off-ball skills, his jumper can still become more consistent to make zone defenses pay. It's amazing to have an opportunity to follow the career of such a transcendent player, arguably the most talented individual ever to grace the NBA court.

http://www.basketbal.../jamesle01.html

#20 Charles Barkley



The Round Mount of Rebound. Charles Barkley was a monster scorer. 65%+ TS was not unusual for him. He was a beast rebounder and he had excellent court vision averaging 4+ assists often during his prime. He was most certainly a leader and he most certainly had heart. He had unquenchable confidence, always played with a chip on his shoulder and was one of the strongest players that ever played from a mental aspect. Most players would shy away from Michael Jordan when they had to face him. Barkley would go right at him and claim pre-game and during press conferences that he is indeed the greatest player in the world. And let me tell you, he’d go out there and try to prove it every single night! Playing against Chuck, you’d never get a night off. His energy, strength, and confidence would scare his opponents. Now Chuck is almost unquestionably the GOAT TNT guy (although Shaq may take that title soon!) but he did have one major weakness in his game. DEFENSE. Barkley was listed at 6’6’’ but according to many sources as short as 6’4’’. He played PF a lot and simply was undersized. He couldn’t contest Karl Malone or Chris Webber or Kevin McHale. I have a couple of pet peeves when it comes to ranking basketball players. One is when a player displays a lack of effort (read Vince *** Carter… yea I had to mention him! ) . Another is when he’s undersized. I hate players who are liabilities on the defensive end. If I had Barkley on my team, I’d exclusively play him at SF but then he wouldn’t be in position to rebound as much which would go against his strengths! He never won a title in his career. I don’t consider it his fault because he had great intangibles but still… His longevity still has him ahead of Lebron.

http://www.basketbal.../barklch01.html

#19 John Stockton



There are bad non-alpha superstars like Robinson and then there are good ones like Stockton. He exemplifies what a point guard should be all about. He is the greatest pure passer that ever lived. Now he isn’t the most talented passer ever… that title belongs to the one and only Magic Johnson but Stockton is the most effective passer in NBA history. He is #1 all-time in career and single season assists, apg, and AST%. He has the highest AST/TO ratio of any star PG in history. John was a solid scorer as well, averaging 15-18 ppg on 50+% shooting in his prime and a very good defender, making a couple of all-defensive teams and getting more steals than any player in NBA history. He often gets criticized for not taking over on offense but that wasn’t his role. He was a facilitator, not an alpha and did so with ruthless efficiency with USG% of under 20% for his career. He let others have the ball and glory but without him, those Utah teams wouldn’t be significant. He is like a role player on steroids. He knew what he had to do and did it while also pulling in more than his share on the defensive end of the floor. He had a productive 19-year career in the league, spending all of it with the Utah Jazz. Playing with Karl Malone has hurt his legacy, fairly or not.

http://www.basketbal.../stockjo01.html

#18 Kevin Garnett



Greatest all-around PF in NBA history. KG scored 20+ ppg in his prime year after year, he won 4 rebounding titles, he had 6 seasons over 5 apg, and he is arguably the greatest defender this game has ever seen. His versatility on that end is insane. There has never been a big that can defend the post and then move to the perimeter and cover guards chasing them around like a hound dog. His quickness, length, dexterity, and intelligence allow him to pull this off. Garnett is a model for consistency as well but his greatest asset is that he simply makes his teammates better. He came to Boston and turned them into a championship team from Day 1. His playing ability certainly helped but that wasn’t it. His energy is infectious, his swag gives his teammates confidence, his intensity and constant communication on the defensive end inspires average defenders to become great ones. He changed the culture of the team and when he was injured in the 09 playoffs, his teams still fed off his energy and did what he had inspired in them. He is a player who makes homecourt advantage really an advantage. When he bangs his head on the basket support or raises his hands into the air, fans in the arena are sent into delirium by his passion and commitment. Upon entering the game, he’s covered in sweat within 2 min. His level of effort, dedication, and pure energy has arguably never been seen in any player in history. There is probably no one that I will miss more when they retire than KG.

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#17 Elgin Baylor



The original highflyer, Mr. Hangtime. Baylor turned a horizontal game into a vertical one with an array of aerial moves that transformed basketball and paved the way for players like Dr J, Michael Jordan etc. But Elgin wasn’t all flash. Before his injury in 1963, he put up 36 ppg 15 rpg and 5 apg over four postseasons. He dominated against arguably the greatest defense ever in the finals. Against Russell’s Celtics he had a series averaging 40+ppg including a 62-point game that is still an all-time finals record! He scored with the best of them, rebounded like a big, passed like a point guard. A Frank Selvy miss on a wide-open 10ft jumper as the time expired in regulation of Game 7 in the 62 Finals cost Baylor his best chance at a title. Elgin made 10 All-NBA 1^st Teams in his career and 8 NBA finals, losing all but 1 to the Boston Celtics! If it weren’t for his prime cut short by injuries, average defensive impact, and a lack of titles, Baylor could have made a significantly bigger dent on this list. His abilities were truly extraordinary.

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#16 Oscar Robertson



Big O. Mr Triple Double. Oscar Robertson is the standard by which any all-around basketball player is judged. Over his first 5 seasons in the league, he averaged a 30-10-10 triple double scoring at higher efficiency than most C’s in the league! High pace or not, that’s still ludicrous. Big O was 6’5’’ but he rebounded like a forward and getting assists was more difficult in Oscar’s era due to how they were credited, making his feat even more impressive. He was yet another victim of the mighty Celtics dynasty, never managing to win a title with the Cincinnati Royals. He was thought of a little bit as a selfish player at times, dominating the ball and putting up good numbers but never winning. His playoff performances also frequently hadn’t lived up to the expectations. In 1970, he got traded to the Bucks where he won a title. After the first year success in Milwaukee, he couldn’t stay healthy but Bucks’ contention for the title was largely a result of Oscar’s declining but still very noticeable presence. Winning an MVP award and a title even if not as a #1 option puts Oscar ahead of Baylor for me.

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#15 Jerry West



The Logo is the single hardest player to rank on this list. On one hand, he was a monster scorer and shooter, great all-around, solid defender, super-clutch and a great playoff performer. On the other hand, a perennial 2^nd place finisher, a guy who wasn’t any of those good things in one postseason run that mattered most. In 1972, Lakers finally won a championship on arguably the greatest team in history. Problem is West had the worst postseason in his career by far, putting up just 23ppg on 38% shooting in the playoffs and 20 ppg on 33% shooting in the finals. Those are not typos! When Lakers lost like in 66, 68, 69, 70, West put up monster numbers and was always efficient. That puts forward this question… There is absolutely no doubt that West was a great player with basically no weaknesses but was he as valuable to his team? If his teams can lose with him playing out of his mind and win in a dominating fashion with him playing god awful, there is something wrong! As his career went on, he switched into more of a PG role and his team success increased. Maybe he was meant to be a more of a facilitator? Maybe his scoring hurt his team as a whole offensively? West retired with no MVP award even though he was the best player in the world a couple of years there in 1969 and 1970. In 1971 with West (as well as Baylor) sidelined in the postseason, Lakers still made the conference finals and lost to one of the greatest teams of all time featuring Kareem and Oscar. There is no doubt that Jerry West had the mentality of a champion and the drive and unquenchable thirst for success, but the question of his real value to the team will always haunt him most in my opinion.

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#14 John Havlicek



Most underappreciated player in history. Drafted to play in the NFL as well as the NBA, the man known as Hondo chose basketball and boy was it a good choice. His physical attributes were astounding. While he wasn’t a high leaper, he was extremely quick, very strong, and probably the most durable player ever. His stamina was unmatched. He would run opponents into the ground with his relentless running game and constant full court pressure that frustrated opponents. He was a great versatile scorer, excellent rebounder and passer, arguably the best perimeter defender ever and yet none of those is his most defining quality. Havlicek has more rings that any player on this list not called Bill Russell. He was a true winner and maybe the most clutch player in history. The 1965 steal against Hal Greer, 40 10 and 7 on 50% shooting in Game 6 to close out LA on the road in the 68 finals, 26 9 and 5 game on 58% shooting in Game 7 on the road to beat LA in the 69 finals, him and Kareem going back and forth late in games in the 74 finals, the shot in 2^nd overtime against the Suns in the 76 finals. These are moments that define Havlicek, playing at his best in the greatest moments. In his prime from 68-74, he averaged a stellar 27 8 and 7 in the postseason and similar numbers in the finals with All-Defensive 1^st Team selections virtually ever year. Few people realize that he won 3 championship rings (68, 69, 74) as the best player on his team. Despite that, he’s a player who would sacrifice his own personal success for the betterment of his team. He played as a 6^th man for the first couple of years in the mid 60’s and deferred to Cowens and White in the late 70’s as his game declined. Missing on his resume is an MVP award and that he was never the #1 best player in the league. I can’t put him any higher because he wasn’t a consistently efficient scorer either who you can count on to carry your team on offense every night in a long season.

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#13 Julius Erving



Enigmatic player. Julius “Dr J” Erving revolutionized the game like perhaps no other player. The tomahawk dunks, acrobatic lay-ups from behind the backboard and out of bounds are some of the signature moments that define the Doctor. I had a lot of trouble deciding whether to put him ahead of West and Havlicek. I decided to go with Erving ahead of them. While Julius won a title as a #2 to Moses in 83 similar to how Jerry did to Wilt in the 72 postseason, Julius played well during the run. Erving’s value to his teams was much more clear to me. Erving won an MVP award in 1981 (something West and Hondo never did) and lost to 3 teams in the finals with dominant big men (Walton once, Kareem twice) that his Sixers simply had no answer for. Erving has a more dominant peak than Hondo and more impressive career longevity than West as well tallying 30k points in his career. I also rated him ahead of West because I feel like he was more impactful on the defensive end because of his off-ball skill and shotblocking. Erving is stuck here and cannot move any higher because his best years were in the ABA, a league where high-paced offensive basketball was played and it was far easier to put up big numbers. When he came to the NBA at age 26, Julius was never quite as dominant as before and did win just one title as a 2^nd option.

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#12 Karl Malone



The Mailman. A name that suits him well because of his remarkable consistency and longevity but is also ironic because Malone could never deliver at those precise moments when his teams absolutely needed it. Karl Malone was a great all-around force in the NBA at the PF position from the late 80’s to the early 00’s, winning 2 MVP’s and losing twice in the championship round to Jordan-led Chicago Bulls. Malone didn’t lack intangibles per se but he could have used more killer instinct and leadership. His career also came to be defined by some of his most painful moments, missing 2 free throws that could win the game in Game 1 of the 97 finals and getting stripped by Jordan for that infamous shot in Game 6 of the 98 finals. On the other hand, Malone doesn’t get nearly enough credit for all his successes. Getting those Utah teams to the finals in the first place with declining John Stockton wasn’t trivial. Luck of the draw was truly against Karl… MJ is the last guy you would want to face in the finals and he is the only one Malone ever faced! He had no weaknesses in his game and generally performed well in the postseason against a tough group of elite big men. Malone is #2 on the all-time scoring list, #6 on the all-time rebounding list, and #1 in all-time FT’s made and attempted. His body of work is undeniable.

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#11 Moses Malone



Another Malone! All-around player? No… in fact he had arguably the most weaknesses in his game of any player on this list. His post moves were rudimentary at best, he was a solid but hardly spectacular defender, and he wasn’t a good passer when compared to other elite bigs. So what the heck did he do well? Two words… OFFENSIVE REBOUNDING. THAT’S IT!! His team would shoot and he’d grab the misses. Sounds like a rebounding specialist… However when you combine his ability to sneak or push himself out of a box out to gain position for the rebound with his incredible strength and physicality, you had one of the greatest forces in history. He would get the ball at point blank range off of a rebound and the defense would be helpless. They would foul him and he’d shoot FT’s again and again. Moses was at his peak from 79-83, winning 3 MVP’s and a title on one of the most dominant teams ever. He made a finals in 81 with a truly mediocre 40-win team. His teammates loved playing with Moses. He was a guy who you didn’t have to feed the ball… he’d get it himself! I’ve watched footages of a playoff half where he would get 20 points, all of them off of offensive boards. His peak is one of the greatest ever but he also played in the NBA for 19 years and another 2 in the ABA. He was one of the first high schoolers ever to enter the league. He is #1 all-time in offensive rebounds by a huge margin, #3 all-time in total rebounds, and #2 In FT’s made. Bottom line is, I love Karl Malone who is a more complete player but if I had to pick which Malone I want on my team, Moses takes the cake. He was more difficult to stop at his peak and managed to win a title in an era that was tougher than the 90’s. He had the it factor, the killer instinct, the alpha male mentality that David Robinson and even Karl Malone never had.

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#10 Kobe Bryant



I’ve always been called a Kobe hater but that couldn’t be further from the truth. I love Kobe’s game and appreciate his status as an all-time great. I only have an issue when people claim Kobe > Jordan. That will never be a real debate despite Bryant’s impressive resume. 5 titles of which 2 as the man, 1 MVP, 2 scoring titles, an 81 point game, 62 in three quarters game. Kobe is one of the most devastating scorers ever unleashed on this league. He is arguably the most skilled player of all-time, more so than MJ. Kobe can make shots from anywhere and with insane degrees of difficulty. He could drive to the rim, rebound, pass, play elite defense, close out games. He has an insatiable killer instinct… there is a reason they call this man the Black Mamba! Turnaround fadeaway 20 footers are miracle shots for anyone else but when Kobe is hot, he nails them. Ironically, what is his strength is also the cause of his greatest weakness. His ability to hit any shot makes him take too many difficult shots on a regular basis, lowering his FG%. His choppy finals performances characterized by poor FG%’s are why it is difficult to consider him any higher. Being a sidekick to Shaq for 3/5 titles is also a dent in his resume. If he has a couple of more strong years, I might be willing to push him to #9.

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#9 Tim Duncan



The Big Fundamental. While not an unstoppable offensive force by any stretch of imagination, Duncan always took over when it mattered. He was a great rebounder, a world-class defender (total crime he never won a DPOY!), and a marvelous passer for a big man. His leadership by example and his quiet confidence make him the most well-liked player of this era. The reason I have him slightly ahead of Bryant is that while he also had some choppy finals performances, he still won 4 titles as the best player on his team and won 2 MVP awards. He to me is a smarter player with regards to shot selection and generally picking his spots. Timmy would never refuse to pass the ball. Why do people call Tim Duncan boring? He isn’t flashy but he’s always been effective. He was never the most dominant player, but he was the player that had the last laugh more often than not. His expression-less face confused opponents. It was hard to get in his head, focused like a laser beam, a champion playing for one goal. The privilege of remaining one. Duncan has been a unique superstar in the decade. With many stars bent on individual dominance, Duncan ALWAYS put team first. The Big Fundamental truly stands for everything that is good in basketball – teamwork, unselfishness, desire, humbleness, and graciousness in those rare defeats.

http://www.basketbal.../duncati01.html

#8 Wilt Chamberlain



Wilt the Stilt. The Big Dipper. The man who rewrote the record books, setting countless scoring and rebounding records that will never be broken. A guy who was so strong, so athletic, so physically coordinated that none of his adversaries had any hope of playing him to a standstill individually. That description sounds like a description for the GOAT, doesn’t it? Well unfortunately, Wilt is far from receiving that kind of honor… For almost his entire career, he played solely for stats and personal glory by winning individual match-ups. Winning was secondary to him and winning 2 titles is a testament to his greatness that he could win despite his shortcomings but he still severely underachieved. He set his mind to never fouling out of a game, refusing to play defense when in foul trouble and hurting his team in who knows how many games. He passed up easy shots just so he could win an assist title. He would either shoot too much early in his career taking his teammates out of their comfort zones or too little in his late career, not taking over in big playoff games when his teams needed it and he could clearly still provide it. His playoff numbers can’t hold a candle to his regular season. If all that wasn’t enough, Wilt was a notoriously bad FT shooter. For all of his regular season heroics and dominance, I can’t put him above any player from here on out because he didn’t deliver consistently enough when it mattered.

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#7 Hakeem Olajuwon



Hakeem the Dream. A super strong and athletic yet gracious big man of truly unmatchable skills. Olajuwon’s footwork and offensive repertoire is legendary… the spins, the turns, the up and unders, the head and the shoulder fakes… He’d execute multiple moves and countermoves leaving opponents including HOF defenders dumbfounded. He could go up with power dunks, hit baby hooks, or nail 15-foot jumpers like it’s nothing. Ask David Robinson. If that wasn’t enough, Hakeem won 2 rebounding titles, was a great passer, and arguably the best defensive player ever. And even that doesn’t come close to describing the Dream. He had the dexterity and speed of a guard. He is #8 all-time in steals and could run the fast break! He was a clutch player who would score big baskets late in games and protect the paint with vigor. He led two of the most difficult title runs ever. One with a truly meager supporting cast and another without HCA in every single series. In those 2 playoff runs, he infamously dominated all the other top big men in the league in devastating fashion leaving behind nothing but rubble. We’ll never know if Hakeem was lucky to not face Jordan in the postseason or vice versa. Probably a little bit of both…

http://www.basketbal.../olajuha01.html

#6 Larry Bird



Larry Legend. The Hick from French Lick. A guy who didn’t even look like an NBA megastar was nothing but. There is absolutely no excuse to say you’ve never watched Bird. You have to see it to believe his real impact. Larry wasn’t athletic, he wasn’t that strong, he wasn’t that quick… but he was smart. Bird is the greatest trash-talker and maybe the most confident player ever and his leadership rubbed on his teammates. It didn’t hurt that he was the greatest shooter ever with unlimited range, could rebound like a big, and pass like a point guard. Larry was an excellent off-ball defender that fit well into a team concept of defense. Larry won 3 titles and 3 MVP’s in the toughest era in league history. His prime was unfortunately relatively short, his career cut prematurely by severe back injuries. He played a couple of more years but was never really quite the same.

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#5 Shaquille O’Neal



Superman. The Big Aristotle. The league had never seen a player like Shaq before or since. The 7’1’’ 320-350 pound beast dominated the NBA for a decade and a half. His athleticism, speed, and vertical for a man of his size were simply unbelievable. The NBA had to get stronger rims and opposing centers started wearing masks and nose guards largely because of this guy. O’Neal struggled as a FT shooter so it was risky to keep him in late in a game and he was a poor pick n’ roll defender but it didn’t matter too much in the big scheme of things. Shaq’s peak is quite simply probably the greatest ever. From 00-02, he led LA to a 3-peat averaging 36 ppg and 13 rpg on 59% shooting in 3 NBA finals combined! There has never been a player more unstoppable than him… EVER. He made guys like Zo, Robinson, Divac, Mutombo, elite defensive bigs, look helpless. He was a Wilt Chamberlain who played a power game, who’d never back down, who had the desire to win and not put up stats as a way to prove himself. It was tough to put him over Bird but I’d rather have 13 prime years of Shaq than 5 prime years of Bird. True he had a big ego and he might leave my team after clashing with our star SG but it’s worth the risk. He stays for a couple of years and I’m almost guaranteed a title even with a fairly average roster.

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#4 Earvin Johnson



Magic. The guy who made Showtime. The greatest point guard who ever lived. 6’9’’ Johnson was a handful, a walking triple double. An underrated scorer who in his prime consistently scored 22-25 ppg on 60%+ TS. He had the greatest court vision of any player ever. He would run half-court sets as well as the fast break to perfection. No look passes, behind the back passes, half court bounce passes… it was all there. Most importantly, his style wasn’t just fun, it was successful. He won 5 titles and made 9 finals in 13 years in the league in the strongest era in league history. Magic would always come through in a big game, arguably the most consistent playoff performer ever. He beat Bird three of out of the four times they met over their careers and had a longer prime. Magic vs Shaq is close but Johnson simply has less weaknesses. Magic could close games, Shaq could not. Magic was the ultimate teammate, Shaq was egotistical. Magic won 5 titles and 3 MVP’s. Shaq won 4 titles and 1 MVP. Magic won in a tough era. Shaq won in a watered-down era.

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#3 Bill Russell



William Felton Russell was traded on draft day for Cliff Hagan and Ed McCauley. How often does a team give up a perennial all-star shooting guard and a top center for a player who hasn't played a single game in the NBA? The answer is when that player has such superior understanding of the game and locker room leadership that what he physically does on the court becomes less important. Of course, Russell was the greatest defensive anchor of all time, leading at least 9 Celtics teams (11 total) to a title and winning 5 MVP's until Hondo took reign of the team in the late 60's. Bill Russell is quite simply the greatest winner in the history of the NBA and maybe any sport period. The reason I don’t have him higher on this list is because he had clear weaknesses in the grand scheme of things. First of all, he was a mediocre scorer, 16 ppg on 43% shooting for his playoff career. He passed very well and was one of the best rebounders of all time but he couldn’t shoulder an offensive load for his team. He could ignite breaks off of defensive rebounds but his success is a product of his era and his team to a fairly large extent. A 6’9’’ center as late as the 70’s just wouldn’t be able to have such an impact. The late 50’s and most of the 60’s were not an era of parity. Boston won the most games in the league from 57-65 and had the most talented teams in that span. As great a leader and motivator Bill was (he was even a player coach from 66-67 season onwards), it cannot bridge the gap with much more talented players ahead who also had monstrous achievements in more competitive eras.

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#2 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar



Originally known as Lew Alcindor, Kareem is the most accomplished player in league history – 6 MVP’s, 2 Finals MVP’s (should have been 4!), 6 titles, 10 finals appearances, #1 on all-time scoring list, #3 on all-time rebounding list, #2 on all-time blocks list (despite the fact blocks weren’t even recorded his first 4 years!). Kareem is one of a type big man. The greatest scorer in history, an elite rebounder, an elite defender and shotblocker. Kareem passed the ball like a guard, had the agility to get more steals than any big ever except Hakeem. Jabbar learned from the greatest leader ever in Bill Russell. His quiet confidence would rally his team, his clutch heroics and game-winning shots are unmatched for a big man. Kareem’s skyhook is quite simply the best shot in history. It was the surest 2 points ever. You couldn’t block it, you couldn’t contest, you could hope that he misses but he rarely would. Kareem’s peak was on Shaq’s level except he didn’t have a problem with his FT shooting. His longevity is the greatest ever. He made 1^st team all NBA at age 22 and then again at age 39. At 40 years and older, his team would still give him the ball when they needed a basket in a close game and he would deliver. His legacy as a good teammate is probably the most underrated aspect of his career. Kareem would sacrifice everything to win, even through the mid and late 70’s when he had truly mediocre rosters.

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#1 Michael Jordan



Jordan is not a better player than Kareem, or more accomplished, or more impactful. If I was drafting one of them as a franchise player, I would take Jabbar. But Jordan is still the greatest ever. Media hype or not, Jordan is the household name in the world of basketball. He inspired and motivated kids to play basketball, he is the reason this forum exists. I probably wouldn’t be writing this article if MJ had never played because I wouldn’t care about the sport. He did everything on the court on an elite level, he showed up in big moments, his killer instinct was almost madness. Even those who weren’t alive in his time have heard of his exploits, the free throw line dunk, the shot over Ehlo, the Flu Game, the Last Shot. His number was retired by NBA teams for whom he had never played. He is the all-time leader in playoff points, PER, and Win Shares.

http://www.basketbal.../jordami01.html

I have never written a sports article this long and it may be my last one. It took quite a bit of time to dig out some of these numbers (some I just came across at RealGM, marge, and a bunch of other NBA History websites that truly have a wealth of information available!).

This article will argue why Kareem Abdul-Jabbar can be easily considered the greatest basketball player of all time ahead of Michael Jordan. The article will discuss the following aspects of Kareem's career:

1) Statistical comparison in prime
2) Defensive impact
3) Longevity
4) Accomplishments
5) Competition
6) Intangibles/Luck
7) Perception of Kareem
8) Quotes on Kareem
9) Summary

1. Statistical Comparison In Prime – MJ vs. Kareem

We will disregard Mike’s Wizards days here as well as Kareem’s play from the 1981-1982 season onwards where he was 34 years or older. Note that Mike in 1997-1998 was 34 years old but he left basketball for almost 2 entire seasons. Both Kareem and Mike had played 12 years to these respective points (1981 and 1998, respectively) and their rookie years were comparable so it’s an excellent place to begin the comparison. Note that blocks and steals weren’t recorded prior to the 1973-1974 season so Kareem’s numbers there are probably underestimated.

Regular Season Numbers:

Kareem: 28.1 ppg, 14.1 rpg, 4.4 apg, 1.2 spg, 3.4 bpg on 55.6% FG and 58.9% TS
Jordan: 31.5 ppg, 6.3 rpg, 5.4 apg, 2.5 spg, 0.9 bpg on 50.5% FG and 58.0% TS

It’s pretty even. Kareem is slightly more efficient and rebounds and blocks a lot more shots. MJ scores more in volume and has a slight advantage in passing and a larger one in steals. It’s worth noting that Kareem’s USG% for the period is ~24% while MJ’s is around ~34%.

Playoff Numbers:

Kareem: 30.3 ppg, 15.7 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.2 spg, 3.4 bpg on 53.3% FG and 56.9% TS
Jordan: 33.4 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 5.7 apg, 2.1 spg, 0.9 bpg on 48.7% FG and 56.8% TS

Stars are born in the playoffs! Same situation as with season numbers. It can go either way! Once again, MJ has a USG% disadvantage with ~36% vs. ~26% for Kareem.

Finals Numbers:

Kareem: 31.4 ppg, 14.2 rpg, 4.1 apg, 0.9 spg, 3.2 bpg on 54.8% FG and 57.7% TS
Jordan: 33.6 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 6.0 apg, 2.0 spg, 0.8 bpg on 48.1% FG and 55.9% TS

Once again very close to identical.

Overall, the two men were very even scoring-wise but Kareem had a much larger advantage in rebounding and blocks than MJ did in assists and steals. KAJ also handled the ball much much less than Jordan.

Did Jordan do better against the toughest competition? Let’s look at MJ’s playoff numbers against the Bad Boy Pistons, early 90’s Knicks, and Payton-Kemp Sonics, the 3 toughest defensive teams MJ faced:

vs. Pistons:
1988 R2 - 27.4 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 4.6 apg on 49% FG 55% TS
1989 CF – 29.7 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 6.5 apg on 46% FG 56% TS
1990 CF – 32.1 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 6.3 apg on 47% FG 56% TS
1991 CF – 29.8 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 7.0 apg on 53% FG 61% TS

vs. Knicks:
1991 R1 - 29.0 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 6.0 apg on 52% FG 60% TS
1992 R2 - 31.3 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 4.3 apg on 48% FG 53% TS
1993 CF - 32.2 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 7.0 apg on 40% FG 51% TS

vs. Sonics:
1996 F - 27.3 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 4.2 apg on 41% FG 53% TS

MJ still played very well but did struggle efficiency-wise especially against the Knicks in 1992 and 1993 and Sonics in 1996. His volume numbers were also lower against these 3 teams compared to his general playoff averages above.

Here are Kareem’s numbers (that I could obtain!) against the greatest defensive teams from his era. Numbers against Thurmond’s Warriors are incomplete.

vs. Knicks:
1970 DF – 34.2 ppg, 17.8 rpg, 4.8 apg on 55% FG 63% TS

vs. Lakers:
1971 DF – 25.0 ppg, 17.2 rpg, 4.2 apg on 48% FG 51% TS
1972 DF – 33.7 ppg, 17.5 rpg, 4.8 apg on 46% FG 49% TS
1974 DF – 30.0 ppg, 18.0 rpg, 5.0 apg on 57% FG 57% TS

vs. Bullets:
1971 F – 27.0 ppg, 18.5 rpg, 2.8 apg on 60% FG 63% TS (mostly blowouts so Kareem played few min)

vs. Celtics:
1974 F - 32.6ppg, 12.1 rpg, and 5.4 apg on 52% FG 56% TS

vs. Warriors:
1971 R1 – 29.0 ppg, 15.6 rpg on 49% FG 53% TS
1972 R1 - 22.8 ppg, 18.4 rpg, 5.4 apg on 41% FG 43% TS
1973 R1 – 22.8 ppg, 16.2 rpg, 2.8 apg on 43% FG 45% TS

Kareem had his struggles against Thurmond’s Warriors but generally got his own against tough defenses. It really seems like a push to me.

2. Defensive Impact

Both Kareem and MJ played on some all-time great defensive teams but in terms of who had more impact on that end, Kareem wins in a landslide. Kareem is a center and anchored a team’s defense in a way a perimeter player like MJ never can. He was intimidating in the paint, blocking tons of shots. Kareem is #3 all-time in regular season blocked shots and #1 all-time in playoff blocked shots. And that's without blocks being recorded in the first four years of his career that were his statistical prime. Jabbar is also a far-superior rebounder to Jordan which is no surprise.

Kareem’s Bucks led the NBA in opponent FG% for 4 straight years from the 1970-1971 season up to the 1973-1974 season, posting numbers of 42.4%, 42.0%, 42.2%, and 42.5%, respectively. The 42.0% is an all-time NBA record. Those Bucks teams had no all-team defenders apart from Kareem.

In terms of career all-defensive selections, Kareem trails only Duncan with 11 total selections. Had there been a DPOY of the year award in the 70’s, Kareem would have won a couple considering how many times he anchored the best defensive teams in his era.

3. Longevity

Jordan and Kareem were both undisputed best players in the league for about 10 years. Kareem led the league in PER and WS 9 times each. MJ led the league in PER 7 times and WS 9 times. However, after those 12 years is where Kareem really separates himself. Jordan goes on to play 2 more unspectacular seasons with the Wizards while Kareem is a top5 player in the league for 5 more seasons after 1980-1981. He won a Finals MVP at age 38 and made 1st Team All-NBA at age 39. He leads his team to 4 more Finals and 2 more titles in this 5-year span as the leading scorer on the Showtime Lakers. Kareem has the best longevity of any career in NBA history and scored the greatest number of points. Only Karl Malone can approach his span of dominance.

4. Accomplishments

Kareem:

6× NBA Champion (1971, 1980, 1982, 1985, 1987–1988)
10x NBA Finalist (1971, 1974, 1980, 1982-1985, 1987-1989)
6× NBA Most Valuable Player (1971–1972, 1974, 1976–1977, 1980)
19× NBA All-Star (1970–1977, 1979–1989)
2× NBA Finals MVP (1971, 1985)
10× All-NBA First Team (1971–1974, 1976–1977, 1980–1981, 1984, 1986)
5× All-NBA Second Team (1970, 1978–1979, 1983, 1985)
5× NBA All-Defensive First Team (1974–1975, 1979–1981)
6× NBA All-Defensive Second Team (1970–1971, 1976–1978, 1984)
2x Scoring Titles (1971, 1972)
2x Rebounding Titles (1976, 1977)
4x Blocks Titles (1975, 1976, 1979, 1980)
1x FG% Title (1977)
NBA Rookie of the Year (1970)
3× NCAA Men's Basketball Champion (1967–1969)
Naismith College Player of the Year (1969)
2× USBWA College Player of the Year (1967–1968)

Jordan:

6× NBA Champion (1991-1993, 1996-1998)
6x NBA Finalist (1991-1993, 1996-1998)
5× NBA Most Valuable Player (1988, 1991-1992, 1996, 1998)
14× NBA All-Star (1970–1977, 1979–1989)
6× NBA Finals MVP (1991-1993, 1996-1998)
1x Defensive Player of the Year (1988)
10× All-NBA First Team (1987–1993, 1996–1998)
1× All-NBA Second Team (1985)
9× NBA All-Defensive First Team (1988–1993, 1996–1998)
10x Scoring Titles (1987–1993, 1996–1998)
3x Steals Titles (1988, 1990, 1993)
NBA Rookie of the Year (1985)
2x Olympic Gold Medalist (1984, 1992)
1× NCAA Men's Basketball Champion (1982)
Naismith College Player of the Year (1984)

Kareem has a notable advantage in the number of regular season MVP’s, NBA Finals appearances, and all-star and all-NBA team selections. He also had what is widely appreciated as the best NCAA career of all-time. MJ has a very significant lead in Finals MVP awards and a DPOY which I want to discuss here.

Kareem was literally robbed of a Finals MVP award and denied another two through no fault of his own.

In the 1980 Finals, Magic Johnson got the award based only on his legendary Game 6 performance. Kareem carried the team through the series up to that point and averaged 33.4 ppg, 13.6 rpg, and 3.2 apg on 55% shooting and 58% TS while also registering 4.6 bpg. He was ROBBED!

Jerry West got the 1969 Finals MVP for being the best player on the court. Same should have happened with Kareem in the 1974 Finals where he put up by far the best numbers of anyone (32.6ppg, 12.1 rpg, and 5.4 apg on 52% shooting and 56% TS) and basically made 2 clutch plays to force OT in Game 2 (block on Cowens in the dying seconds) and win Game 6 (game-winning 17-foot skyhook over Cowens with 2 seconds left). If there was ever an argument for a losing player to win this award, this was it right here.

Finally, Kareem was the best player in the 1982 Finals on a very balanced Lakers team (Magic, Nixon, McAdoo…) but was inadvertently denied the MVP by his coach. In Game 3 and Game 5 which were blow-outs by LA and Philly, Kareem played limited minutes and took 12 and 6 shots respectively while other Lakers stars were left out on the floor. Magic ended up winning the MVP but any player could have won it.

Thus, Kareem did win 2 Finals MVP’s but should have won at least 3 and easily could have won 5 with the numbers he put up. MJ has an advantage here but it’s a minor one. The DPOY award wasn’t given prior to the 1982-1983 season. Had it been, given that Kareem led the best defense in the league for 4 straight years while in Milwaukee, he would have won a couple of these awards.

5. Level of Competition

Kareem faced much stiffer competition in the playoffs at both his position and in general than Jordan did. At SG, the best player MJ faced is Drexler and then there is a huge drop-off with guys like Dumars, Moncrief, and Ainge. Kareem faced all-time great 2-way centers like Wilt, Thurmond, Reed, Lanier, McAdoo, Walton, Gilmore, Moses, Hayes, Cowens etc. When you take into account that the league had fewer teams in the 70’s than in the 90’s, Kareem faced much tougher adversaries on a night to night basis.

In terms of the overall level of competition in their primes, MJ faced 3 top 20 players ever in the playoffs. One was Magic who was clearly on decline and whose team was decimated by injuries in the 1991 Finals. The other is Malone who had a much less talented team than Jordan. Stockton in 1998 was not much better than Kidd is right now. The final one is Shaq who actually beat MJ’s Bulls once in 1995. Other notables Jordan faced were Ewing, Barkley, Drexler and Thomas. Kareem faced older Wilt, West, Baylor, Thurmond, Barry, Reed, Frazier, Walton, Cowens, Havlicek, Hayes, Unseld, Erving, Moses, Sikma etc. Wilt (albeit past his prime), West, Baylor, Havlicek, Moses, and Erving are all top20 players.

6. Intangibles/Luck

Kareem transformed a 27 win Bucks team into a 56 win team in his rookie season and lost to the eventual champion Knicks despite outplaying Willis Reed by a large margin. In his sophomore season, far past his prime but still effective Oscar Robertson came to the Bucks and Milwaukee won 66 games and a title going 12-2 in the playoffs behind Jabbar.

Then, in the 1972 season, Jabbar again led the Bucks to 63 wins behind only what many consider the GOAT team of all time in the 1972 Lakers. Kareem put up monster numbers and despite popular belief destroyed Wilt in 5/6 games of the Lakers series putting up 35 18 and 5 on 46% FG/ 53% TS and holding Wilt to 37% FG shooting. However, 2nd option Oscar was injured in the series and couldn’t even put up 10 and 5. Role players McGlocklin and Jones played in the series but were greatly limited. The series was also controversial. Late In a close game in Game 6, Kareem blocked a shot which went off of West but hit the referee, preventing it from going out of bounds. The ball was given to LA. Kareem gave arguably the GOAT team of all time a run for their money all by himself.

After the 1973 season which saw the greatest disappointment in Kareem’s career where he was outplayed by Nate Thurmond (the only time in his prime anyone outplayed him!), Kareem again led the Bucks to the best record in the league in 1974 but Lucious Allen and Oscar were injured and the former didn’t play in the playoffs. Bucks still made quick work of LA and Chicago before facing Boston in the Finals. Kareem had a monster series against the Celtics (see above) but lost to them in a controversial Game 7. Cowens got his 5th foul at the beginning of the 4th quarter in Game 7 with a 3-point lead for Boston. However, referees allowed him to get away with a LOT OF HARD CONTACT down the stretch without fouling out and Boston squeaked by with a win. I watched this entire game and the officiating in the 4th quarter of this game was very much in favor of the Celtics. There are no ifs, ands and buts about it. Coincidence? Perhaps… but is still happened!

In the 1977 series against Walton’s Blazers, Kareem outplayed Bill by a wide margin (30.3 ppg, 16 rpg, 3.8 bpg, 61 FG% vs. 19.3 ppg, 14.8 rpg, 5.8 apg, 2.3 bpg, 51 FG%) but Lakers simply didn’t have enough guard play as both Kermit Washington and Lucious Allen didn’t play due to injury. Blazers’ guards embarrassed the Lakers as their backups couldn’t even get the ball across halfcourt in the face of full-court press late in games.

Finally, Kareem was the best player in the 1984 Finals but Magic made crucial mistakes throughout the series (“Tragic Magic”) and the Celtics beat the Lakers in Game 7 to take the title.

KAJ is probably the most unlucky player of all time and had a lot of breaks go against him. With more luck on his side, he could have challenged Russell’s 11 titles.

7. Perception of Kareem

History has not been kind on Kareem for many reasons. First, he played in an era where racial stereotypes were still common place. A black guy who converted to Islam and was the most dominant player in the league… it really is no surprise he wasn’t well liked back then. It is well documented that his matchups with Havlicek, Cowens, and Walton were always portrayed by the media as “good” vs. “evil” with Kareem being the latter. What makes things worse and which Kareem himself acknowledged is that during his early playing career, he was very aloof and rarely responsive to the media which brought him a lot of additional scorn from them. Playing with a charismatic personality that was Magic later in his career helped him become very well liked by the time he retired in 1989.

8. Quotes on Kareem

Bill Walton: "I lived to play against Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. He was the greatest player I ever played against, by far. Better than Jordan. Better than Magic. better than Bird. Better than Dr. J. Better than the best of the best that I played against. Better than Rick Barry. He was my source of motivation for everything I ever did. Everything I did was to try to beat this guy. I lived to play against him, and I played my best ball against him. No matter what I threw at him, though, it seemed like he'd score 50 against me. His left leg belongs in the Smithsonian. And it wasn't just offense. He was a great defender and rebounder, a great passer, a wonderful leader. He was phenomenal. "

Jerry West: "We had two writers in L.A. that were killing him in the newspaper that should have been fired. It was unfounded bias. People expected more than he was doing. It was never enough. Those (Lakers) teams in the late 70s would have been lucky to win 20 games without him. Yet we were always in the playoffs. We just didn't have enough pieces."

Wilt Chamberlain: “I really needed help to guard Kareem. He is the only guy. "

Pat Riley: "Why judge anymore? When a man has broken records, won championships, endured tremendous criticism and responsibility, why judge? Let's toast him as the greatest player ever."

Nate Thurmond: “The first time Kareem came to the West Coast, he was playing against Wilt in Los Angeles the night before playing us in San Francisco. I needed an advantage. So I flew down and watched that game. I could see the moves he did against Wilt and what he liked to do best.

Larry Bird: Kareem was probably, with his size and his skyhook, the most dominating force in our league as far as getting a basket any time you want it."

Julius Erving: “Bill Russell is the greatest champion but Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is the greatest player in the history of the game.”

9. Summary

Kareem vs Jordan
Offensive Play – EVEN
Defensive Play – EDGE KAREEM
Longevity – EDGE KAREEM
Accomplishments – EVEN
Competition – EDGE KAREEM

Who else scored 38 000 career points?
Who else played in the league for 20 seasons? (and made the All-Star team in all of them!)
Who else won 6 MVP's?
Who else played in 10 NBA Finals?
Who else anchored the best defenses in the history of the league?
Who else faced six top20 players in the playoffs in his prime?
Who else led a team to a championship in his 2nd year in the league?

Jordan didn't do any of those... Do you still believe MJ is definitely the GOAT?

In the past, the Toronto Raptors were known for making idiotic draft picks, bad trades etc. But this year, it is different, they are determined to be a better team on both ends of the floor and finally be able to reach the playoffs once again by adding depth, a defensive mindset and hard working young players.

The Toronto Raptors have finally woken up in the 2012 summer. Despite making some minor mistakes in the draft, they still had a decent draft by drafting two athletic and hard working players!

The draft:

With the 8th pick in the 2012 NBA draft, the Toronto Raptors select, Terrence Ross. People have been criticizing this pick since Jeremy Lamb and Austin Rivers were still waiting to get picked by a team but to be honest, this selection is not that bad as people make it out to be. Terrence Ross is a hard working wing (Shooting Guard/Small Forward) that is extremely athletic, He's a high flyer that is also a very talented one on one defender. Also, he could shoot the ball off the dribble or catch and shoot. He's has a very fast release as well. As a Raptors fan, I am confident about this selection and I think he will become a really good player playing next to DeRozan, Kyle Lowry and all those young but more experienced players than Ross.



With the #7 Pick in the 2nd round of the 2012 NBA Draft, the Toronto Raptors select, Quincy Acy. Now this dude means business. I don't know about you guys but I feel like this player will really give the Raptors some aggressiveness and character. He's a high flyer that dunks the ball VERY HARD. I don't know why people have been comparing him to Reggie Evans. This dude has great hands, he could get up, dunk the ball hard, he's an athletic freak as well. That's pretty much what he does on offense! On defense, he uses his athleticism to block shots and try to be as dominant as possible as he is also a pretty good rebounder. Off the court, Quincy Acy is a very hard worker just as much as Terrence Ross.



Free Agency:

I don't know if the Toronto Raptors are done yet with Free Agency, trades and stuff in the summer but I think they have done an amazing job compared to last year.

First of all, the Raptors have signed Landry Fields from the New York Knicks with a huge 20 million contract. I would say this is over-payed but the Raptors do have the money to afford him and I think this is a good sign. The Raptors have really looked to acquire some good defensive mindset players and he's one of them. Good defensive player, hard worker and he could shoot the ball well averaging for his career around 47% from the floor! Another wing for us that will probably play the SF position with James Johnson!



The second move the Toronto Raptors made was even bigger and way more important than Landry Field's. The second move the Raptors made was for a point guard... for a point guard that we desperately needed. Jose Calderon was definitely not enough to run the point in the starting five. He's a good passer and shooter and doesn't commit a lot of turnovers but his defense is awful and that's not what we're looking for as we move on and try to reach the playoffs. So the Raptors, today, July 7th 2012, have traded a lottery pick in order to get Kyle Lowry from the Houston Rockets to join them! Kyle Lowry last year had an All-Star caliber season before his injury. He was playing great defense, was leading the Rockets, he was shooting the ball well and was passing it better than ever in his career and I think this was a better acquirement than getting Nash as we're more focused on the future.



Raptors future:

The Toronto Raptors future is in fact pretty bright. Jonas Valenciunas, a Lithuanian center that the Raptors drafted in 2011 is finally joining the league in the 2012-2013 season and he's expected to be a force for the Raptors. In this league full of weak centers, Jonas will be able to dominate as he has pretty good height, strength and length.
Also, Kyle Lowry and DeMar DeRozan, the upcoming great back court is going to be amazing for us. DeMar is one of the hardest workers in the NBA. Every year, he comes with a new strength. Last year, his shot improved immensely. This year, interviews have said that he's built a lot of muscles so he could be in the rotation for the SF position!
Ed Davis and Amir Johnson are also part of our rebuilding plan and future but one of the most important is Andrea Bargnani! He's improved a lot last season and stepped up as our leader and we're looking forward to see more of that next season.

Let's not forget about the other role players such as James Johnson, Jared Bayless as the backup PG and more.

And also, Dwyane Casey who totally changed the culture of this team. Now, the Raptors are a defensive mindset team and more of a force in the East.

No more Lakers threads. Please...

What are you, Kobe's official advocate???
Who cares if a f***ing millionaire has to pay 40.000$?!?!
NO ONE.

It all began on May 19, 1976 in a small town called Greenville, South Carolina. That is the birthplace of NBA legend, Kevin Maurice Garnett. Garnett moved from his hometown of Greenville, South Carolina, to Chicago, Illinois, due to racism. In Chicago, Kevin played for Farragut Career Academy, and instantly shined. He led them to a 28-2 record, averaging 25.2 points, 17.9 rebounds, 6.7 assists and 6.5 blocks, and shot 67% from the field. Due to this amazing stat line, he won the National Player of the Year award, and was named the Most Outstanding Player at the McDonald's All-American Game. After high school, Garnett declared for the 1995 NBA draft. There, he was selected 5^th overall by the Minnesota Timberwolves.

Since he first entered the league, Garnett has been a dominant force in the NBA. In his rookie season, he averaged 10 points, seven rebounds, two assists, one steal, and almost two blocks. The next year, he improved by a great amount, averaging 17 points, eight rebounds, three assists, and two blocks. That year was his first NBA all-star game appearance of many. After his first all star game appearance, he ended up visiting 13 other all star games, 14 in total. In 2003, he even won the All-Star MVP award. In 2004, he had an outstanding year. He averaged 24.2 points per game, 13.9 rebounds per game, five assists per game, 1.5 steals per game, and 2.2 blocks per game. He led the league in rebounds and win shares, with an impressive 18.3. Another category he shined in that year was defensive win shares. He had eight defensive win shares. That is a very high mark. This impressive stat line allowed Kevin Garnett to snatch NBA MVP. This was his first and only MVP award he won in his career, but he has many, many other remarkable seasons. In the 2004 Playoffs, Garnett led the Minnesota Timberwolves to the Western Conference Finals, but unfortunately they fell short to the Los Angeles Lakers in six games.

In 2008, Garnett was traded to the Boston Celtics in exchange for seven players, which includes Ryan Gomes, Gerald Green, Al Jefferson, Theo Ratliff, and Sebastian Telfair, which is the most players traded for a single player in NBA history. With the additions of Hall of Famers Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett, the Celtics had formed a dominant trio of superstars. The Celtics’ big three consisted of three future hall of famers, Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and Kevin Garnett. The three dominated games, all averaging over 17 points per game. Garnett had a very impressive year in 2007-2008, and his defense is what really stood out. He averaged 1.9 blocks per game, 1.4 steals per game, and had a defensive win shares of 6.2. He also led the entire NBA with a 92 Defensive Rating. Defensive rating is an estimate of how many points allowed per 100 possessions.

The Big Ticket is a great playoff performer. He always plays very well in the post season. In the 2001 NBA playoffs, Garnett had only played three games, but when he played them, he was very effective. He grabbed an average of 18.7 rebounds, five assists, 24 points, and almost two blocks per game in those three games he played. He also was a huge factor in the Boston Celtics' 2008 title run. During the post season, he averaged 20.4 points per game on around 50% shooting, 10.5 rebounds per game, 3.3 assists per game, 1.3 steals per game, and 1.1 blocks per game. KG was arguably the most valuable player on the Celtics during the title run. Also, KG has made many clutch plays in the playoffs. He has made many game winning shots in the post season, as well as in the regular season.  He is a very good post player and can hit from mid-range. Combine that with legendary defensive and superb passing for a seven-footer, and you have an NBA legend.

KG is known for his high intensity and love for the game. You can see the look in his eyes when he plays, and just tell he has a burning love and passion for the game of basketball. Every loose ball, every rebound, every time the ball is heading out of bounds, Garnett is hustling everywhere on the court. He brings such intensity to the game, which makes him a very fun player to watch. He is always trash talking, celebrating, pumping his fist, banging his chest, screaming, ect. He is considered “mean” by opponents, because of his ruthless trash-talking. But that is just the way KG has always played. KG is the most intense player to ever play basketball, and that is one of the biggest reasons why he will forever be remembered in this league.

Garnett has a very impressive resume. 14 all-star game selections, one time NBA MVP, one time NBA Defensive player of the year, nine player of the month awards, eight all NBA Defensive First teams, five time NBA leading defensive rebounder, two time total rebound leader, current leader in total career rebounds, active NBA win shares leader (181.6), and of course, NBA champion. As you can see, Garnett has accomplished many great feats during his legendary NBA career.

The Big Ticket, in my opinion, is the second best power forward to ever play NBA basketball, behind the great Tim Duncan. Many consider him to be number three behind Tim Duncan and Karl Malone, but I think Garnett is the better player. Kevin Garnett has averaged more rebounds per game, assists per game, has a better Defensive Rating,  has more blocks per game, has much less turnovers per game, more rebounds per game in his playoffs career, more assists per game in his post season career, also more total career blocks, in less seasons played. Garnett definitely has the upper hand in defense, and passing. Garnett is also a slightly better rebounder. But, there is no denying that Malone is the better offensive player. Plus, Malone never carried his team to a championship. Garnett has. In 2008, Garnett carried the Celtics during the playoffs and into the finals. His defense, clutch plays, passing, and intensity were too much for the competition in 2008.

Although Garnett is past his prime, and aging, he is still an elite player. He can still put up a good 20 points and 10 rebounds any given day. During the late part of the 2011-2012 season, Garnett made the transition from power forward to center. He managed the switch very well, and is now an elite center. He never played any other position besides power forward in his NBA career, but he has done excellent at center. I think he is the third best center in the league, behind Dwight Howard and Andrew Bynum. When KG retires, the NBA just won’t be the same. One thing is for sure though, and that is Kevin Garnett will never be forgotten in NBA history.

Hoops-Nation.com has reached a new milestone! We've now surpassed one million posts on the forum!

 

Gotta say, I really love this community. Wasn't expecting anything this amazing when I originally put the forums together. Couldn't ask for greater people to be apart of the Hoops-Nation!

 

Hoops-Nation Rule-book
Instead of making a complex rulebook with a bunch of things I know no one will read, I decided to make it very simple.


Empowering Moderators
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Throughout NBA History, we have seen some of the greatest athletes in all of sports, like the Michael Jordan's, the Kobe Bryant's, the Lebron James', and the Wilt Chamberlain's. But who will we remember ultimately as the greatest players of all time and who will we forget as the history books continue to build up? Let's count down for the top 25 players of all time shall we?

25. John Stockton:10 time All-Star, holds playoff record for most assists in a game (24), led the league in assists 9 times, led the league in steals two times, 2^nd best player on 2 runner-ups (1996-1997 Utah Jazz and 1997-1998 Utah Jazz) missed 22 games throughout his whole career, played 82 games in 17 of 19 seasons, first all time in assists, third all time in games played, has and average of 13 PPG and 10.4 APG, member of the '92 Dream Team

                  John Stockton was one of the best Robins of all time, running the show at point for Utah and excelled in Utah with their Stockton-Malone duo, that worked very efficently on offense with their pick and roll. He was unbelieveably consistent throughout his whole career, even in his final NBA season, there was no major drop for John Stockton. He had one of the best careers in terms of longetivity, only dropping below 7 assists per game, once in his career, and will be known as one of the best playmakers ever. He certainly wasn't ever the best point guard in his era, with the likes of Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas, Gary Payton, prime Penny Hardaway, and prime Kevin Johnson being there, but he will still go down in history as one of the greatest playmakers ever.

                                                                                         
24. Bob Cousy: 13 time All-Star, '57 MVP, two All-Star MVPs, record for most assists in a half (19) led the league in assists 8 times, 2^nd best player on six Boston championship teams, most playoff free throws made in a game. Average of 18/8/5 throughout his career.

                      You may now be asking, “really? Ahead of Stockton?” Yes. Really. He was the floor general for Boston during those 6 championships, was a quality scorrer, and one of the better floor generals, has an MVP, and of course, those 6 championships that he won with Russell. Cousy also finished second in points and first in assists in 1954 and 1955. He never was lower than top three in assists throughout his whole career and cracked at least top ten in scoring eight times in his career, and had the highest assist average eight straight times. He also had a 50 point playoff game against Syracuse where he went 25 for 25 from the free throw line. Cousy was arguably the best point guard in the 60's and opened the door for guys like Magic, Payton, Stockton, Nash, and Paul today.

23. Isiah Thomas: 12 time All-Star, 1990 Finals MVP, two time All-Star MVP, led the league in assists one time, led the league in minutes one time, finished seventh all time in assists, 14^th all time in steals per game, best player on 2 championships (1989 Pistons and 1990 Pistons)

                       Poor Isiah. He gets commonly hated on throughout NBA history. Whether rightfully so or not, he gets hated on for being one of the worst GM's, no one wanted him on the Dream Team, even though he was clearly better than Laettner, and arguably better than John Stockton, everyone on the Dream Team didn't want him, especially Michael and Scottie, who were both sour after Thomas ordered the Pistons players into the locker room without congratulating Chicago, even Magic didn't want him on the Dream Team. Despite how much he gets hated on, he put on one of the most remarkable performances in NBA Finals' history, spraining his ankle in the third quarter, and still put up 25 in the third quarter, in a desperate attempt to finish off the Lakers in game six of the 1988 NBA Finals. He gets knocked off for having multiple feuds with Jordan, and people commonly forget Isiah as one of the greatest point guards of all time.

22. David Robinson: 10 time All-Star, '95 MVP, '90 Rookie of the year, All-Defensive First Team eight times, Defensive Player of the Year ('92) led the league in scoring once, rebounding once, and block shots once, 2^nd best player on a championship team ('99 Spurs) starter on another championship team ('03 Spurs) member of the '92 Dream Team, scored 71 points in one game and put up a quadruple double in one game (34 points, 10 rebounds, 10 assists, and 10 blocks)

                         Robinson commonly gets overlooked as one of the best centers ever, and gets completely lost in the discussion along with the likes of Kareem, Russell, Chamberlain, Shaq, and Hakeem. But make no mistake. He was one of the best players to play the game. He was strong, athletic, had good defensive tactics, and had a good offensive game. The knock on Robinson is that he was never the best center of his era. Throughout his prime, Hakeem dominated as the best center in the game and in the later part of his career, Shaq was easily the best center in the NBA. He was though, one of the greats, and was conducted himself nicely, and was very humble. He also had a three year peak where he averaged 28/11/3.

21. Scottie Pippen: Seven time All-Star, led the league in steals once, 2^nd best player on (1991-1993 Bulls and 1996-1998 Bulls) four year peak of 20/8/6, averaged 22/9/6 in the 1991 NBA Playoffs, All-Defense 10 times, member of the Dream Team.

                  Scottie Pippen and Michael Jordan was the most succesful duo of all time, winning six championships, and Pippen was the alpha dog for Chicago while Michael Jordan was under his baseball stint from 1994-1995. During that stretch, Pippen was a top five player in the league. He was one of the best defensive swing men of all time, and could give you the whole package. He was a good alpha dog, but is arguably the GOAT “Robin”. We will always remember Pippen for his six championships with Chicago and the infamous Game 3 of the 1994 Knicks series when Pippen refused to enter the final play for game three because Phil Jackson called the play for Toni Kukoc. That play was probably the biggest knock of his career. During Jordan's baseball stint, Scottie's ego was high. He felt like he should be the best player on the team. That he should be taking the last shot, and it was an insult for Jackson to call the last play for Kukoc. Despite this, Scottie was definitely the GOAT “Robin”

20. Charles Barkley: 11 time All-Star, '93 MVP, led the league in rebounding once, best player on runner up ('93 Suns) member of the '92 Dream team, averaged 22.1 PPG, 11.7 RPG and 54% shooting throughout his career, part of the 20K points, 10K rebound club.

                  Sir Charles is a hell of a funny analyst on TNT and he was certainly, without a doubt, one hell of a basketball player. He was undersized to play power forward, listed at 6'4, but he was a great rebounder, and an average defender and a great scorer. He was one of the most explosive power forwards ever and had a really versatile game. He was a great chemistry guy and was a great trash talker. He certainly deserved to be on the Dream Team and he's certainly a delight to have on TNT for Inside the NBA. He had a three year peak of 26/13/4 and in the Suns' '93 Playoff run, he averaged 27/14/4.

19. Lebron James: 8 All-Stars, MVP ('09, '10, '12) best player on two runner-up ('07 Cavaliers, '11 Heat) best player on championship ('12 Heat) one of eight players to win three MVP's, one of four players in NBA History to lead his team in five different statistical categories, led league in scoring (1x) All NBA First Team (6x) All Defense First Team (4x) one time Gold Medalist ('08 Redeem Team)

                    There is no question, with Lebron's most recent NBA Championship and Finals MVP, he is definitely already in the talks for one of the greatest to play the game. Top 10 is premature, but there is no question that he belongs in around the 15-19^th mark. He is probably the most criticized and most hated basketball player in recent memory, but this season, Lebron was just plain awesome. No question about it. He definitely deserved the MVP award and the Finals MVP. He stepped up when it mattered. Game 4. Indiana. Eastern Conference Semi Finals. Lebron puts up one of the greatest stat lines in the playoffs, ever (40 points 18 rebounds 9 assists 2 steals and 2 blocks). Game 6. In a win or go home situation against Boston. They went back home alright. But with the series tied at three games a piece. Did Wade take over? No. Did Bosh take over? Heck no. It was Lebron James, destroying the Boston Celtics in game six with 45 points 15 rebounds and 5 assists preventing the haters from talking how Lebron choked. He just had so many clutch moments this season. He deserves to be on this list. And if he wins a few more championships and finals MVP? Well. We'll talk about that if it happens.

18. Julius Erving: 11 time All-Star NBA MVP ('81), runner-up MVP ('80), best player on three runner ups ('77, '80, '82 Sixers) second best player on NBA championship ('83 Sixers) All NBA First Team (5x) All NBA Second Team (2x)

                        The Doctor is one of the hardest players on the greatest of all time list, simply because of his ABA stint. There is no question that he was the best player in the ABA during that time. I personally don't think that the ABA stint should count, but if I were to count it, he'd be much higher on the list. Doctor J revolutionized the game for today. He made the game more exciting with his dunks and in the ABA, averaged 28.7 PPG and 12.1 RPG in his ABA career. If you were to combine his ABA and NBA stint together, he'd be in the 30 and 10 K club, which is pretty spectacular. We'll remember Erving as one of the most influential and exciting players of all time, and opened the game for young high flying athletes today.

17.John Havlicek: 13 time All Star, '74 Finals MVP, All-Defense First Team (5x) led the league in minutes (2x) most career assists for a nonguard (6114) second best player on two championships ('68 '69 Celtics) best player on two championships ('74, '76 Celtics) played for eight championships, 25K point club, played for eight championships, 12^th all time in points scored, '74 Finals MVP.

                         Hondo is commonly one of the more forgotten small forwards in NBA history. He was complimentary to the eight championships that he won with Russell and the Celtics to say the least, and during the '74 and '76 title run, he was the alpha dog of the Boston team. He was a great scorer, averaged 22/7/5 throughout his whole playoff career. We will all remember Hondo for the “Havlicek stole the ball!!!” moment.

16. Elgin Baylor: 11 time All-Star, '63 MVP runner-up, '59 Rookie of the Year, All-Star MVP ('59) best or 2^nd best player on eight runner-ups (Lakers throughout the 60's) 4^th all time in PPG average (27.4) and 10^th all time in RPG average (13.5) 20K and 10K club.

                         Another small forward we forget throughout NBA history. Baylor was a monster at scoring and on the boards. He had a three year peak of 35/17/5 and a four year playoff peak of 35/15/4. And in 1962, in only 48 games played, due to military service, he averaged 38/19/5 where he could not practice at all. That 1962 season is up there for one of the greatest statistical seasons ever in my opinion. If he won at least a couple of times during the Lakers' 60's run, he would most likely be much higher on the All-Time greats list.

15. Kevin Garnett: 12 time All-Star, '04 MVP, '00 runner-up, Defensive Player of the Year ('08) All Star MVP ('03) led the league in rebounding (4x) 2^nd best player on championship ('08 Celtics) 2^nd best player on runner-up ('10 Celtics) 20K-10K Club

                        Garnett is one of the most defensive minded athletes of recent history, as well as he is obsessed about winning. He's really passionate about the game and put defense above everything else. I never liked Garnett. I always thought he was a dirty player, and I still detest him at this point, especially that he's on the Celtics, but I can't help but respect what KG has done throughout his career. He made such a big impact on Boston when he first joined the team in '08. He changed the culture of their defense and helped them win the title. Kudos to him.

14. Karl Malone: 15 time All-Star MVP ('97 '99) All Defense (3x) All Star MVP (2x) member of the 1992 Dream Team, first all time FT's made and FTA's, second all time in points, sixth all time in rebounds, fourth all time in games played, second all time in minutes played, 35K-14K club, 11 All-NBA first teams, best player on two runner ups ('97 '98 Jazz) starter on one runner-up ('04 Lakers).

                       The Mailman delivered for the most part throughout his career. He was amazingly consistent, in 19 seasons in the NBA, he only dipped below 20 points twice in his career and never dipped below eight rebounds a game. Amazing consistency. He only dipped below 20 points per game in his rookie season with Utah and in his final season with the Lakers. He made the finals three, but was defeated two times by Michael Jordan's Chicago Bulls and was upset by the underdog Pistons in the final year of his career. Overall, Karl Malone had a tremendous career and has one of the best careers in terms of longetivity out of all the NBA greats.

13. Moses Malone: 12 time All-Star, '83 Finals MVP, best player on one championship ('83 Sixers) best player on 1 runner-up ('81 Rockets) MVP ('79, '82, '83) led the league in rebounding (6x) led the league in minutes (1x) one of eight players to be a three time MVP, fifth all time in rebounds, fifth all time in games played, seventh all time in points, 12^th all time in minutes played.

                       Moses Malone definitely has a resume of one of the all time greats, being a three time MVP. In the playoffs throughout his career, he averaged 22/14 and is one of the best rebounders of all time, averaging 12.2 rebounds a game. Already, with three MVP's, he deserves to be on the list as one of the top 25 greatest payers of all time. His championship also validates that he should be on the list.

12. Kobe Bryant: 15 time All-Star, Finals MVP ('09 '10) MVP ('08) led the league in scoring (2x) best player on 2 championships ('09 '10 Lakers) 2^nd best player on three championships ('00, '01, '02) arguably best player on one runner-up ('04 Lakers) best player on another runner-up ('08 Lakers) 25K Point Club, All-Star MVP ('02, '07, '09) All NBA First Team (10x) All Defense First Team (9x)

                        The resume speaks for itself. Kobe Bryant is one of the greatest players of all time. And he's still here, in an attempt to improve his resume. He has five championships as well as two Finals MVP, and if he wins any time before he retires on the Lakers, he will most likely be the Finals MVP of that Lakers' team as well. He is just so great. In a leader standpoint. He takes and makes so many tough shots. To me, he was the best player in the league in 2006. That season was the same season where he scored the second most points in NBA History (81) as well as outscoring the Mavericks through three quarters by himself (62-61) as well as setting the record for most points scored in MSG (61 points). He has averaged 25/5/5 throughout his career and has built up a great career in terms of peak (averaged 33/6/5). He has yet to dip below 24 points per game since the 1999-2000 season, and will look for his sixth championship this year.

11. Oscar Robertson: 12 time All-Star, MVP ('64), Rookie of the Year ('61) 2^nd best player on championship ('71 Bucks) starter on runner-up ('74 Bucks) 25K point club, averaged 25.5 PPG, 9.5 APG, 7.5 RPG throughout his career. First (and only) player in NBA history to average a triple double

                         Oscar Robertson was probably the greatest all around player in NBA history. His scoring was extremely high, as well as his assists numbers, and his rebounding numbers was really high for a point guard, averaging almost eight boards a game. Here's another amazing stat. During his peak in the playoffs, he averaged 31/11/9 in 22 playoff games. Really good right? He also averaged 47.2 minutes per game!!! He almost played every single minute of the game! Just amazing. Also in 1962, we remember Wilt's 50/25 season, but let's not also forget Elgin's 38/19/5 statline while in the military, and of course, Oscar Robertson's historic triple double season.

10. Jerry West: 14 time All-Star, Finals MVP ('69) All-Defense (4x) set record for most free throws in a season (840) set record for most PPG average in one playoff series (46.3) led the league in scoring (1x) led the league in assists (1x) best player on 6 runner-ups ('65, '66, '68, '69, '70, '73) second best player on 2 runner-ups ('62, '63) best player on one championship ('72)

                          Now you're really mad aren't you? You're probably saying “How dare you put a '60's player ahead of Kobe Bryant! Kobe Bryant is the greatest SG in Lakers' history!”. I love Kobe. I really do. He's one of my favorite players of all time. But I need to open some eyes here. Before you stop reading this article in pure anger, please consider these few things. You say that Kobe Bryant is a better defender? Jerry West was a better defender. In his last season, they started keeping track of steals and blocks and West averaged almost three steals a game. West was a better passer, averaging almost 7 assists per game as a shooting guard, about two assists more than Kobe. West was a very underrated rebounder, averaging almost six rebounds a game, about one more rebound per game than Kobe, and he shot about 47% from the field. Great for a shooting guard. In 55 games in the NBA Finals, he averaged 30.5 points per game, averaged 27 points per game throughout his career, and averaged 26/6/10 during the stretch during the Lakers' 33 game winning streak in the 1971-1972 season. I hoped that I opened up some eyes and did not lose some readers in the process.

9. Tim Duncan: 13 time All-Star Finals MVP ('99 '03 '05) MVP ('02, '03) Rookie of the Year ('97) best player on 4 championships ('99, '03, '05, '07 Spurs) All Defense (12x) (eight time first all defense) All NBA First Team (9x)

                       Tim Duncan has one of the best resumes of all time. His two MVPs, three Finals MVP's and four championships speaks for itself. He has great longetivity, averaging 20/11 and two blocks throughout his career, was arguably the greatest player of the decade, with Kobe Bryant being a close second and in the '03 playoffs, he was tremendous, averaging 24/15/5, which is outstanding. Timmy did it efficiently, and was a tremendous leader on and off the court.

8. Shaquille O'Neal: 15 time All-Star Finals MVP ('00, '01, 02) MVP ('00) six top five MVP finishes, Rookie of the Year ('93) best player on three championships ('00, '01, '02 Lakers) second best player on one championship ('06 Heat) best player on one runner-ups ('95 Magic) second best player on one runner-up ('04 Lakers) led the league in scoring (2x) led the league in field goal percentage (9x) 2^nd all time in field goal percentage. 25K-10K club.

                        The Big Diesel is one of the most loved sports figures of all time, constantly very funny and one of the most dominant big men ever. He was so strong and mobile in his prime, averaging 29/14/4 in his peak and in the three championships he won with the Lakers, he averaged 30/14/3 on 55% shooting. He averaged 25 points and 11 rebounds a game throughout his career, and was constantly on different teams like the Magic, the Lakers, the Heat, the Suns, the Cavaliers, and the Celtics. Shaq was arguably the most dominant center of all time in his prime, but there are better players than him. And so we continue.

7. Hakeem Olajuwon: 12 time All-Star, Finals MVP ('94 '95) MVP ('94) All Defense (9x) Defensive Player of the Year ('93 '94) tied for most playoff blocks in a single game (10) holds record for most career blocks, led the league in rebounding twice, led the league in blocks three times, best player on two championships ('94 '95 Rockets) best player on one runner-up. 25K-10K club.

                       The alpha dog of the NBA during Jordan's baseball stint is number seven all time. The Dream had amazing footwork in the post, was a terrific post defender, and was the clear cut best player in the league at the time during Jordan's baseball stint. His combined playoff averages between the '86 '94 and '95 playoffs, he averaged 29/11/4 and in the '95 Playoffs, he averaged 33/10/4.5 with 62 blocks in the whole playoffs and beat Malone, Barkley, Robinson, and Shaq. Great run by Hakeem the Dream, Olajuwon. By the way, I'd love to see the '95 Rockets against Jordan's Bulls to see who was the better team just to see a matchup between Hakeem and Jordan. We never got to see a matchup in the NBA Finals between the two best players in the 90's, unfortunately.

6. Wilt Chamberlain: 13 time All-Star MVP ('60, '66, '67) one of eight players to win three MVPs Finals MVP ('72) Rookie of the Year ('60) led the league in scoring seven times, led the league in rebounding 11 times, led the league in assists once, led the league in field goal percentage nine times, led the league in minutes eight times, holds season records for PPG (50.4) RPG (27.2) Field Goal Percentage (72.7%) most points (100) most rebounds (55) consecutive scoring titles (7) first all time in rebounds, fourth all time in points, fourth all time in minutes, best player on one championship ('67 Sixers) second best player on one championship ('72 Lakers) second best player on three runner-ups ('69, '70, '73 Lakers) best player on one runner-up ('64 Warriors) 30K-20K club (only player in that club)

                          The second best center in the league in the 60's is right here at number six. He of course has the record for most points in a game (100) as well as averaging 50/25 in the 1961-1962 season. He was obsessed with stats and had this thing with trying to not foul out, which is odd. When he was in foul trouble, he stopped defending as well. He put his stats ahead of the team, which is a bad thing. Yeah, stats look good on paper, but they aren't any good if you put them ahead of your team. Wilt was a statistical monster, probably the greatest stat sheet stuffer ever, and might be the most obsessed player with stats all time. Respect to Wilt for putting up great stats in his prime, but I don't really like how he sometimes put stats ahead of the team.

5. Larry Bird: 12 time All-Star, Finals MVP ('84, '86) MVP ('84, '85, '86) Rookie of the Year ('80) All Defense (2x) led the league in threes (2x) led the league in free throw percentage (4x) highest career APG for a nonguard (6.1) best player on three champioships ('81, '84, '86 Celtics) and two runner-ups ('85, '87 Celtics) member of the Dream Team. 20K point club.

                         Larry Legend was truly a legend in the green and white. He was a tremendous all around player, was good on defense, a great scorer, and did whatever it took to win. He averaged 27/10/9 in the '87 Playoffs, 24/10/6 on 50% shooting, 88.6 percent from the free throw line for his career and so many clutch moments. I have come to respect Bird for what he did, winning three MVPs and three championships, but I also detest him. Bird was an amazing shooter, was dead on from wherever, and was one of the greatest trash talkers of all time.

4. Magic Johnson: 12 time All-Star, Finals MVP ('80, '82, '87) three time MVP ('87 '89 '90) one of eight players to win the MVP three times, led the league in assists (4x) steals (2x) free throw percentage (1x) second best player on three championships ('80 '82 '85 Lakers) best player on two championships ('87, '88 Lakers) second best player on two runner-ups ('83 '84 Lakers) best player on two runner-ups ('89 '91 Lakers) holds 12 playoff records, member of '92 Dream Team, 10K assist club.

                        Magic is without a doubt, the greatest Laker of all time. He dealed with adversary after forcing Westhead out, receiving a bunch of criticism for that, was called Tragic Johnson after the '84 Finals and dealt with the HIV virus, forcing him to retire early. Did he just give up? Hell no. He came back stronger and stronger than ever. After the Lakers lost to Boston in '84, he led the Lakers to two series victories over Boston in three years, he had probably the clutchest shot in NBA Finals history, hitting the game 4 skyhook against Boston in the 1987 NBA Finals, was an inspirational leader, and happy go-lucky. He averaged 26/8/13 in the '87 Finals, averaged 19.5/7/11.2 throughout his career. He finishes as the fourth best player of all time and probably the best all around point guard the league has ever seen aside from Oscar Robertson.

3. Bill Russell: 12 time All-Star MVP ('58, '61, '62, '63, '65) one of eight players to win three MVP's, led the league in rebounding five times, second all time in RPG, first all time in RPG in the playoffs, holds record for most rebounds in one half (32) most rebounds in the Finals (40) averaged 29.5 RPG in the Finals, best player on 11 championships and 2 runner-ups (late 50's and 60's Celtics) 10-0 in Game 7's, 16-2 in elimination games, only player-coach in NBA history to win a title (2x)

                         I can't amount for how much Bill Russell has done. You may think that I overrate Bill Russell. Your reasoning may be because he wasn't that great of a scorer unlike Wilt Chamberlain, or Magic Johnson, or Larry Bird. He wasn't ever as dominant as Shaq or Hakeem on the offensive end. But he absolutely was a monster on defense. It was so hard to get a shot up in the paint because Russell was always there blocking your shots. Of course, blocks and steals weren't taken into acount back then. Russ also instigated the Celtics offense and when Cousy retired, Russell was always the guy who started off their offense. He was the main focus of their offense. Whether it was a rebound and a quick outlet to a cherry picking John Havlicek for two or a backdoor pass by Russell to Sam Jones, he did it all. His offense is very underrated and he is probably the greatest defensive player of all time.

2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: 15 time All-Star Finals MVP ('71 Bucks, '85 Lakers) MVP ('71, '72, '74, '76, '77, '80) Rookie of the Year ('70) All-Defense (11x) led the league in scoring (2x) rebounding (2x) blocked shots (2x) FG percentage (1x) minutes 1x) all time leader in points, minutes, FG's best player on four championships ('70 Bucks '80 Lakers '82 Lakers '85 Lakers) and three runner-ups ('71 Bucks '74 Bucks and '84 Lakers) second best player on one championship ('87 Lakers) third best player on one championship ('88 Lakers). Member of 35K-15K club.

                                        Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is the best center in NBA history. He was great on defense in the earlier part of his career, has two Finals' MVP, six MVPs, which is the most in NBA History, was a great teammate, and holds multiple records, including the all time leader in points. In '87, when Riley asked Kareem if he could be the number two option with Magic being the alpha dog of the team, he was perfectly fine with it. He was a mysterious figure, rarely showing much emotion. He was definitely the best player of the '70's and played on multiple championships and has a good case for GOAT, but the next guy has a better case, and is viewed by many as the greatest player of all time.

BRIAN SCALABRINE!!!!!!

Just kidding.

1. Michael Jordan: 16 time All-Star, MVP ('88, '91, '92, '96, '98) Rookie of the Year ('85) Finals MVP ('91, '92, '93, '96, '97, '98) Defensive Player of the Year ('88) All-Defense First Team (9x) averaged over 30 PPG eight times, averaged over 34 points per game in seven different playoff years, led the league in scoring (10x) led the league in steals (3x) most scoring titles of all time, most consecutive scoring titles (7) most Finals MVPs (6) highest points in a Finals series (41.0 vs the Suns in '93) most playoff points, most playoff points in a single game (63) most points in one half of an NBA Finals game (35) third all time in points, 30K point club, most threes in one half, third all time in steals.

                          Give yourself a high five if you survived for this long and read this whole article word for word! Obviously, Michael Jordan was the clear cut GOAT. Just had a killer instinct, the best of all time, tremendous scorer, averaged 30/6/5 throughout his career on 50% shooting and 84% free throw shooting, averaged 33/6/6 in the playoffs, and averaged 34/6/6 in the Finals, with so many clutch moments. What else is there to say? The resume speaks for itself. Michael Jordan is the greatest player of all time.

1962

 

OMG guise change your radios to channel 10, Wilt is going OFF on the Knicks. He's already got the NBA record at 80 points and there is 8 minutes left!!! 

 

1962 end of the season

 

Ok, Russell is great and all, but Oscar got [expletive deleted] robbed of the MVP #Rigged4Boston

 

1967

 

Now that the Russell era is over, its finally Wilt's time. You guys can call me a Wilt stan all you want, but I'll have the last laugh when Wilt retires with more rings.

 

1968

 

#RIGGED4BOSTON #RIGGED4BOSTON #RIGGED4BOSTON

 

1970

 

So are we gonna act like Wilt didn't choke? Also the Willis Reed stunt was some [expletive deleted]. man [expletive deleted] the Knicks

 

1971

 

Big O + Kareem GOAT duo 

 

1972

 

So are we gonna act like Wilt didn't clutch? Wilt is winning titles at this age and Mr MVP Kareem can't even beat him SMH

 

1973

 

As a Knicks fan I'm really happy to win our 2nd title. Holzman is a great coach, I look forward to winning more with him in the future.

 

1977

 

Do you guys realize how overrated the ABA and Dr. J was? the guy barely scores 20 PPG in this league. 

 

1980 

 

Kareem is out and they said they are starting Magic at C, SMH #Sixersin7

 

1983

 

You Sixers fans are delusional, we beat your ass the last two times we've played in the Finals and all of the sudden you think Moses is going to make some kind of difference? Against Kareem? puhlease.

 

1984

 

Jordan had a great college career, and I don't blame Chicago for taking them, but its evident in NBA history that the center position is the most important. If Houston or Portland had taken him it would have been a huge mistake. Hell, I think taking Jordan over Sam Perkins was a mistake too. 

1991

 

LOL so are we gonna act like Jordan didn't choke? Had a wide open jumper to win Game 1 and it rolled out. #Lakersin4

 

1992

 

Obv, the Bulls just had more depth than the Lakers last year. Portland is way deeper and Drexler is arguably just as good as Jordan with better 3 pt shooting. I think the Blazers will win in 6. 

 

1996 during Finals Game 3

 

WHY AREN'T THEY PUTTING PAYTON ON JORDAN SPOFAJDF:SLK:SELKJGTW:TJEWT:KETLJ

 

1997

 

Did you guys see Iverson cross Jordan? dude is the real deal

 

2000

 

Air Canada in his first playoff series #Rapsin4

 

2002

 

Kings got [expletive deleted] robbed #refball #riggedforLakers

We should get a bunch of users on here to pitch in and get an NBA League Pass account and we could share it

Like if 100 of us put in 2 dollars we could get a full year (I think)

I think its a beast ass idea, what do u guys think?

PS: This is for the poor kids like me who can't afford it

I am really bored so I decided to do this. Please do not post mean comments if you are left out. It really isn't easy to get on this list and you must stay dedicated and loyal to site for a long time. Hope you all enjoy.

Shout out to Tony Hoops.
Obviously, Tony Hoops is the greatest user of all time. I am not including him on the list because he is anonymous number #1. He is a great owner to the site and is making HN great!

Just missing the cut:
Melo7-Melo7 is a great user and has been on the site for a while. He is on the first page of posters and has recently came out of retirement. He is left off the list due to his long time of inactivity and small amount of reps.
DwightyTee-DwightyTee is easily the best girl member we have on the site. Along with that, she is IMO the nicest user as well! It hurts to leave her out but sadly not everyone can make it.
Vino-One of the greatest GSL GM's of all time. He is a intelligent user and has been loyal to the site for a very long time. Not everybody can make it though.
Ben-One of the best certified writers we have on the site! He has also been on the site for a good amount of time. Some more rep and he will be on this list.
Motion-Easily is member #26.One of the most underrated and nicest users on the site!
Along with these people,Clutch, mstrpc,TheLogo,Mentch,Stefan,PFP, AirWarrior.
There are many users that deserve to be on this list and it sucks I can't include them!


The Top 25 Users on Hoops-Nation:


#25:Poohdini(Chicago Bulls)
Group:Members
Posts:6,658
Rep:870
Member Since:June 15th, 2011
-Pooh comes in at #25. He is considered an underrated user to some. He is a solid GM in the GSL for the Miami Heat. He's mostly active in the GSL but is a solid user when he comes out and talks NBA.As far as I remember, Pooh has never started drama.He is one of the best Bulls fans on the site and in my opinion has one of the best names. Pooh has never been a crazed poster and I doubt he will ever move up in the top 10. Still, if he retired today he would finish as a top 25 user of all time and would be remembered as a solid user.

#24:Dash(Houston Rockets)
Group:Members
Posts:7,066
Rep:978
Member Since:March 27th, 2011
-Dash is a 5 star member that represents the Houston Rockets. He is arguably a top 10 GM in the GSL for the Boston Celtics. Popularity wise, he has always been a liked member.Dash is a user that likes to avoid drama most of the times. He is also one of the smarter users we have on the site. Dash's rep/post ratio earns him a spot here in the top 25. He has always been a great member and deserves a spot here. I could see him finishing his HN career as a top 20 member."Pepper thy angus" is his shit.

#23:Leandro Barbosa(Chicago Bulls)
Group:Members
Posts:8,765
Rep:709
Member Since:June 9th, 2011
-Leandro is a solid GM in the GSL for the Charlotte Hornets. He recently improved his post count and should be considered a top 25 user. I think he is a sort of underrated. The problem with D-Rose is that his rep count is really holding him back in the rankings.I don't remember a time that Barbosa has started unwanted drama on the site. He is on the first page for posters and is extremely active. If he had his rep up into the 1000's he could be ranked 5-10 spots higher. I could see Leandro being as active as Korv and Bosh someday.We will have to wait and see if Leandro takes advantage of his full potential.Either way, he is a very good improved user.BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD CLEAR YOUR PM'S.

#22:Nick C.(Los Angeles Lakers)
Group:Members
Posts:3,310
Rep:1,238
Member Since:May 4th, 2011
-Some may call this a reach, but Nick deserves to be in this spot. Besides the fact he is almost on the 4th page of posts, he is a great user. His rep/post ratio may be the best on the whole site. He is one of the best debaters and has remained active for a while now. Along with that, he is one of the most mature and oldest users we have on the site.Nick C. has never and will probably never start a fight on here.Mr.Nick is one of the most classy and efficient users we have on the site. If he could get his posts up, he could finish his HN career as a top 10 user when its all said and done.

#21:Gary(Golden State Warriors)
Group:Members
Posts:12,410
Rep:531
Member Since:July 21st, 2011
-Some new members might not believe it, but Gary use to be a very well known and popular user on the site. He was a top 10 user at one point on this site. It seems Gary disappeared from the site for a little, but is still here. His rep count keeps him from cracking the top 20. Still, he is on the first page for most posts and is a quality member. If i'm not mistaken, he use to be a moderator. If Gary could improve his rep, he could finish his HN career as a top 20 member. You'll never really see him starting fights on here. Like Dash, he is a 5 star member.

#20:Korv(Memphis Grizzlies)
Group:Certified Writers
Posts:12,300
Rep:1,750
Member Since:August 2nd, 2011
-The one, the only, BASED KORV. The Andrew Bynum of Hoops-Nation.Korv is the most loved, hated and probably the most popular user on this site. Along with that, he is one of the youngest. Korv is one of the most active members on the site. Korv also is one of the worse GM's to ever be in the sim league, but he has shown major improvements. He has 2 of the most liked posts in HN history.Korv often receives a lot of criticism for being "immature" and a "drama starter".If he could mature up and make more solid posts, he could finish as one of the greatest HN users ever. Still,Korv will finish his HN career as a top 10 poster. Too sum everything up, Korv pretty much tells um.

#19:Mirrors(Miami Heat)
Group:Global Moderator
Posts:6,331
Rep:1,022
Member Since:July 17th, 2011
-Mirrors is a new global mod that can be underrated sometimes. He is a real Heat fan and has always been active on this site. His rep/post ratio is one of the best on hoops-nation. He is a very intelligent user that knows what he is talking about. I see Mirrors as one of the more mature users on the site that likes to steer clear of drama. If he could get his posts up into the 10,000's while keeping his rep up, I could see him being a possible top 10 user someday. This is one user that I wouldn't want to get into a debate with.

#18:Nably(Chicago Bulls)
Group:Members
Posts:7,891
Rep:1,284
Member Since:July 17th, 2011
-Nably is a slutty member that migrated from Y!A . He is one of the best Bulls and Derrick Rose fans on the site. He has a great rep/post ratio and is at the top of the second page for top posters. He is a popular user on the site and one of the more funny ones. He knows his NBA but has never really got into debates. He is a user that won't start drama, but will jump in a drama topic and troll when he feels like it. He deserves a spot in the top 20. "Go Bulls!UC is rocking!" is his throwback name.

#17:And1Ellis(Boston Celtics)
Group:Moderator
Posts:8,357
Rep:1,290
Member Since:June 27th, 2011
-Okay, he can stop bitching now. And1Ellis is one of the most underrated users on the site. Hopefully, putting him at #17 will change all that. He is a solid moderator and is one of the best mix makers we have on the site.He has a good post/rep ratio and is always active. He is one of the best Celtic fans this site has ever had. He has been exciting us with his flashy mixes for over a year now. And1Ellis usually stays out of drama, but I've seen him in a few incidents before. Overall though, he is a great versatile user.

#16:TeoTheGreek(Chicago Bulls)
Group:Member
Posts:9,457
Rep:1,437
Member Since:December 4th, 2011
-Teo is another user that is very underrated. He may even be the most underrated user on the site. He is one of the best Bulls fans that has ever been on here. Teo is a mature and intelligent user. He knows his NBA and especially knows his Chicago Bulls. He is very underrated as a debator, as I believe he is one of the best we have. I have never seen TeoTheGreek in any drama on the site. He is the only active user we have from Greece.

#15:TheTruth(Boston Celtics)
Group:Member
Posts:11,394
Rep:1,116
Member Since:July 23rd, 2011
-TheTruth is another very underrated user. If you ask me, he is the most underrated user of all time. He is an extremely active member that sticks to the NBA and stays out of drama. He is a great debator and is one of the most intelligent members that we have. I think TheTruth is best Celtics fan that has ever been on hoops-nation. Even though he changes his name a lot, he always seems to have a great user name. TheTruth is underrated as it is right now, and sadly will probably always be.

#14:Ant(Philadelphia 76ers)
Group:Member
Posts:12,767
Rep:1,353
Member Since:October 10th, 2011
-Easily the most slutiest member we have ever seen. Ant is an intelligent NBA and 76er fan that migrated from Yahoo Answers. TheTruthMan is oozing with troll potential and could burst at any moment . He was a solid GM in his time in GSL as the 76ers GM. He is also one of the most popular and loved members on the site. Ant is one of the most funniest members we have also. I'll admit it, Ant is the greatest Sixers fan to ever be on hoops-nation.

#13:Djoker(Toronto Raptors)
Group:Global Moderator
Posts:8,751
Rep:2,046
Member Since:March 24th, 2011
-At one point, you could argue that Djoker was the best user we had ever had on the site. He has fallen back a bit, but is still a great member. He has an incredible rep/post ratio. He is a one of the most mature and intelligent users we have on the site. He is arguably the best debator we have here. You will never see Djoker getting into drama. The only time he is in drama is when he is stopping it. If he could get a few more thousand posts, he could jump up into the top 5. Still, he is a 5 star user and is an all-time great.

#12:Lil Penny(Sacramento Kings)
Group:Admin
Posts:7,501
Rep:2,764
Member Since:January 14th, 2011
-Like Djoker, at one point you could argue that Penny was the best user we had ever had on the site. He is extremely intelligent and loyal to his Sacramento Kings. Penny is easily the best Kings fan we have ever had on the site. The new admin will stop drama over starting it. Even though he is on the 2nd page for top posters, he deserves a spot in the top 15. If Penny could get a few more thousand posts, he could make a jump into the top 5 with Djoker. #Playoffs2013.

#11:Flynnatic(New York Knicks)
Group:Member
Posts:13,972
Rep:1,671
Member Since:February 12th, 2011
-Flynnatic is a very active member that is nearing 15,000 posts. He is one of the best Knicks fans we have ever had on the site. He has been known to be very loyal and prideful of his team. Flynn is also a good GM in the sim league for the Portland Trailblazers. He knows his NBA and his New York Knicks. You will usually see Flynn staying out of drama, unless he is flicking me off on Omegle. Flynn has been on the site longer than most members and has always been loyal to the site.

#10:Swish(Toronto Raptors, Oklahoma City Thunder, Los Angeles Lakers, etc...?)
Group:Moderator
Posts:26,866
Rep:2,429
Member Since:January 2nd, 2011
-One of the most active and well known users to ever be on the site. Swish is a fan of many teams and often gets criticized for it. Even with that, he is a great member.Sacha is the best recruiter by far on the site.He is a moderator and has recently stepped down from a higher position. Swish has taken a fall in user rankings due to some recent inactivity, but still remains a top 10 member. He was one of the first members to ever be on the site. He usually doesn't cause drama. Swish is one of the most unique members we have had on the site, but is an all-time great.

#9:Jay(Los Angeles Lakers)
Group:Member
Posts:15,238
Rep:1,779
Member Since:July 11, 2011
-Even with Jay stepping down as a moderator, he is still a great member. Jay is one of the greatest Laker fans to ever be on the site, and there is a lot of those. He is pretty smart when it comes to the NBA. Usually Jay is pretty drama free. He is one of the more popular and nicer members on the site. In my opinion, he is the most loyal and prideful fan on the site. He loves his Lakers and he shows it. Jay could move up this list by getting some more rep. Still, he is an all-time great member.

#8:The Future(Portland Trailblazers)
Group:Global Moderator
Posts:12,808
Rep:1,572
Member Since:June 12th, 2011
-The Future, also known as Darko M. is one of the most intelligent users on the site. He is a great debator and loves his Portland Trailblazers. He is one of the more mature users that stays away from drama.He is easily the best Blazers fan we've ever had. He has a solid rep/post ratio and is a good Global Moderator. He is generous when it comes to giving out reps which makes him very likeable:cool:. He makes a lot of topics and starts a lot of ideas for the site. He is an all-time great user, and one of my favorite mods.

#7:Dr.Wolf(Minnesota Timberwolves)
Group:Admin
Posts:14,441
Rep:1,540
Member Since:April 29th, 2011
-Dr. Wolf may be the smartest user on hoops-nation. He is very mature and is big help to Tony and the site. He helps run the sim league. In my opinion, Dr.Wolf is the best GM ever.Dr.Wolf is the best Timberwolves fan that has ever been on the site. He has won multiple championships and simply knows how to win. Wolf stays out of drama as he is an admin.He is a well known user and is very likeable.Along with that, he is one of the nicest users on the site. Dr.Wolf is an all-time great user and has been huge in hoops-nations development.

#6:TheRealistPoet(Los Angeles Lakers)
Group:Global Moderator
Posts:26,482
Rep:2,491
Member Since:February 12th, 2011
-TRP has and always been one of the most laid back members on the site. He is one of the best Lakers fans HN has ever had and one of the best users HN has ever had. He is a loyal Lakers fan and a loyal HN member. He is a popular member on the site and has always been big help to Tony. I have never seen TRP in any type of drama. He is one of the most active members of all time. He is an intelligent friendly user. TheRealistPoet is one of the greatest users HN has ever had. I think at times, he can be underrated.

#5:LikeABosh(Miami Heat)
Group:Members
Posts:35,548
Rep:2,223
Member Since:March 6th, 2011
-Boshy is easily the most active member ever. He has the most posts in HN history, and is still the only user with 30,000 posts. He is a very well known user but can be underrated sometimes. He is the best Heat fan to ever be on the site, and nobody even compares. He usually avoids drama and has always stayed out of the spotlight. Being one of the best HN members ever, it is amazing that he has remained a member this whole time. Boshy deserves to be a top 5 member and is one of the greatest ever. #BoshyForAdmin

#4:SportsFan93(Dallas Mavericks)
Group:Members
Posts:17,140
Rep:2,472
Member Since:January 31st, 2011
-SF has always been a great member and is easily the best Mavericks to ever be on Hoops-Nation. Despite drama in the past, he has remained a great user and has stayed active. He is one of the most intelligent users on HN. He is a great debator and it seems is never wrong. SportsFan is always in the Sim League and is a top 5 GM. He was one of the best admins that Tony ever had. SF is still a top 5 user and is one of the best users to ever be here.

#3:Snowman The Frosty(Chicago Bulls)
Group:Global Moderators
Posts:21,879
Reps:2,379
Member Since:July 17th, 2011
-Da Bulls is easily the most improved member in the past few months. His post and rep count shot up and he currently sits at #4 for most posts in HN history. He is one of the most friendly and popular users on the site. He is also an incredible GSL GM, known for consistently raping others. In my opinion, he has the best name on the whole site.Frosty is also the best Bulls fan to ever be on the site.He is a much deserved Global Mod. Frosty is one of the most active users on the site as well. Frosty could easily keep climbing up and is already an all-time great.

#2:MaddSkillz(Charlotte Bobcats)
Group:Certified Writers
Posts:13,503
Rep:2,843
Member Since:January 1st, 2011
-C-Buc has been on this site longer than anybody else. He did a lot for this site and was key to its development. He is one of the most creative users on the site and is easily the best Bobcats fan to ever be on the site. He is the most popular user on the site and has the most reputation. He will most likely be the first user to 3,000 reps. Skillz activity has slowed down and the end may be near for the great Skillz. Whatever happens, MaddSkillz is one of the best users ever and should never fall out of the top 10 as long as the site is up.

#1:Rogggy(Los Angeles Lakers)
Group:Admin
Posts:15,279
Rep:2,498
Member Since:February 21st, 2011
-Rog has been huge to the development of hoops-nation. He is the creator of the Sim League and has created a lot of activity. He is a great admin and user. Rog is the best Lakers fan to ever be on the site, and there is a lot of them. People really don't understand the work he puts into the Sim League. He is extremely devoted to the site and is a major part to its success. Along with that, he is one of the most intelligent users on the site. Heis one of the best GM's. Roger should be known as the greatest user to ever be on Hoops-Nation.


Thoughts?



















TCM,Dante, TGIA, NastyNas my #0's<3.

Overall:

Andrea Bargnani, the 7 foot tall big man originally from Italy got picked by my favorite team, the Toronto Raptors, in 2006 as the #1 draft. in 2006, he was the 4th Italian ever to play in the NBA! Like many rookies, he did not have a GREAT season in his first year but us, fans were very hyped up of what he could bring on the table.



Strength:

Andrea is a shooter... a very good shooter that uses his height and length to shoot over smaller opponents. He could shoot the three ball, the mid range and also the fade away shot. He has a decent post game and could finish around the rim despite being a little bit soft.. we all have faith in him because he's a really good scorer. I remember when he scored 41 points against the New York Knicks in 2010 being our leader when Bosh left Toronto! Last year, being our leader, Bargnani averaged 21 points per game.



Weaknesses:

Despite being very talented on offense, it's in my opinion the total opposite on defense. Bargnani does not know what passion, hustle and energy is all about. It seems like he's always lazy and tired when it comes to showing leadership on both ends of the floor and not only on the offensive end. Andrea is for his height an awful rebounder. Last year, he only averaged 5.20 rebounds being our LEADER! Remember guys, the guy is 7 feet tall! And on defense, it's the same thing. He's not a good shot blocker or on ball defender and does not show any hustle to me or to any Raptors fan.



My 2 solutions are simple:

I think that the Raptors have two solutions. Either have faith in him and hope that he will finally be our leader on both ends of the floor, show energy, passion, hustle, leadership and VOCAL leadership OR, we could also trade him and Calderon (because both never want to play defense) for some young prospects that could give us what we want: HUSTLE, PASSION, ENERGY and DEFENSE

Since my staff team and I feel like everyone deserves a second chance, we've decided to switch up our rules on Hoops-Nation's forums.

Before, we would permanently ban trolls and members who consistently broke the rules (arguments, spamming, etc.).

Now, we're going to set up a new system that will still demolish any trolls or unnecessary posts, but will be much less strict and will totally exclude banning users.

Here's how it goes:
If a member constantly gets reported for trolling, spamming or harassing other members of our community, we will setup a restriction on his or her user account that requires moderators to preview & approve your posts before it goes public. This restriction can be anywhere from a couple hours to a couple weeks, depending on how cooperative the offender is. In order for your post to go public, a staff member would have to approve it.

We will also add a new application to our staff team that allows a staff member to ban a user from a certain topic, if necessary.

Hit 'LIKE' if you like these new changes.

(it's not really an article.. it's mostly what I think about DeRozan's progress and what he needs to do to be a better and very valuable player for any team)

DeMar DeRozan, one of the best dunker in the league has been selected two years ago by my favorite team the Toronto Raptors.. I was happy that we finally selected someone that could dunk  and I knew that one day or another he would be someone special! Finally, it wasn't another one of those European we have selected many times... no offense to anyone.. I'm European to.

Demar has been working hard on his game since playing basketball but right now, he's been really impressive to me. Two years ago when he joined the league, he did not even have a jump shot! He just drove to the rim to dunk or just dished it to Bosh for him to make a play!

With a lot of work this past summer before the 2010-2011 season, he developed a jump shot that became bread and butter for him! He also slightly improved his on ball defense and has been in my opinion a better first option than Bargnani who was supposed to be way better for us.. Come on now the guy is a great shooting big man but we can not continue with him. He can't rebound or defend like a real big man!

Anyways, I think DeRozan has a long way before becoming a star. He has a lot to work on but I have a lot of faith in him since he has a great work ethic. He needs to improve his court vision and passes, his three point shot, his help and on ball defense, his rebounding.. well.. he pretty much could improve everything. It seems like a ton of work but as I already said, I believe in this guy.  Works pays off at the end of the day so hopefully it will pay off for him and the Toronto Raptors. One way or another, I'm sure that he will become a star and will bring my Raptors back to the playoff race.

BRING BACK THE NBA BTW!!!!!!!!!!

If you would like me to message you with details and screenshots about the new project we've been working on for Hoops-Nation, please LIKE this post. We could definitely use some opinions and suggestions!

Not only with his great performance against the Mavericks but also with:
 

 

WOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

 

This was worth its own thread in General NBA I don't care.

 

(if any staff wants to move it, feel free to do so)

The Man behind the Nation, Tony Hoops

Two years ago I was lucky enough to meet this guy on Facebook who loved Basketball just as much if not more than I did. He asked me if I would join his group, Hoops Nation. Then he asked me if I would come and join and write on his web-site that he was starting up. It was the best Christmas present that I could have received as I had been looking for an opportunity like this for quite some time.

So as our Nation has just clebrated its second birthday, who is this man that made all of this possible for us?

As I have attempted many times to write this profile. As I have tried to find a way to take all of you on the path to the "Man" that is "Our" Nation. The only way I can do him justice is to let him tell you who he is…
So let’s journey into the "Man" that is Tony Hoops...

What made you decide to start Hoops-Nation?
Ever since my pre-teen days, I loved talking basketball, whether it was with my friends, family or even strangers at the barbershop. I found myself consistently hopping through forums, but never being fully satisfied with the communities, due to the way the administrators controlled things. After being fed up, I decided to create my own community, revolving around my own ideas and perspectives of how it should be ran. Fortunately, my staff team and I put together this amazing website we call Hoops-Nation.

Why is Hoops-Nation so important to you?
Everyone has their place to escape once they have a ton of thoughts and stress on their mind. Hoops-Nation is that place for me. I love talking basketball and just being with the community. I never thought an online website would ever give me that homey, comfortably and cozy feeling.

What is your ultimate dream for Hoops-Nation?
I'd love for us to be as big as Real GM one day. Additionally, another dream/goal of mine is to have our community host nothing but intelligent conversations and debates.

What are the great things about being the owner of H-N?
The greatest thing about being the owner of H-N is having such an amazing community and staff team to work with. Our people are truly gifted with intelligence and have extremely entertaining personalities.

What are the challenges about being the owner of H-N?
There is way too many to list, but I love each and every challenge that comes my way.

Tell us the origin of your name, Tony Hoops
When I created my basketball Facebook page, I put in a random name... like Basketball Hoops or something in that context. Then, I decided to change that name to my real name... so I changed Tony to my first name, but it did not allow me to change my last name due to Facebook policies. It stayed as Tony Hoops, and I stuck with it since it sounds pretty catchy in my opinion.

What else do you do besides H-N
I play basketball, spend time with my family, friends, and girlfriend, and go to college full-time. I used to party from Thursday to Sunday, but this semester got me really caught up since I have class Mon-Sat.

Tell us about your family
My parents are pretty easygoing. I have two older brothers (24 and 23), who basically live life like the civilized Charlie Sheen.. and a younger sister, who is actually celebrating her 14th birthday today. We're a very close family who will do anything and everything for each other.

Where are you from / live / grew up
I'm born and raised in Los Angeles, California. I've never moved, and never plan on it. I love my city and can't imagine living anywhere else. However, I do love to travel and explore the world though!

Did you / do you play basketball
I play basketball, but not as much as I used to. As a kid, I would play from morning to night.. before school, during school, and after school. I slowed down though, after my doctor said I had the "Osgood-Schlatter disease", which is a painful swelling of the bump on the upper part of the shinbone, just below the knee. Nothing to serious, but it stopped me from playing 24/7 like I used to.

What do you love about the game / NBA
Honestly, everything. I love the three pointers, the layups, the dunks, the big shots, the nice passes, the clutch plays, the fans, the broadcasters, the coaches, the GM's, the trade rumors, the free agent signings, the game plans, the cheerleaders, and just about everything else you could think of that relates to basketball.

If you could change one thing about the NBA what would it be
I would let the players play more physical. I want to see players bashing heads and showing emotion more often. Whatever happened to those heated rivalries and crazy NBA fights?! Things are getting too soft nowadays.

What would you like your legacy in the world to be
My legacy from everyones standpoint wouldn't be as important to me as my legacy from my family’s standpoint.. Therefore, I'd just love to be known as a hardworking father who gave his all to his family and kids. But to answer your question, I'd love to be known as the man who connected the basketball community, and also took the marketing industry to another level (since I have a passion in marketing).

What’s your favorite meal, band / song, color, movie at the current time
I love sushi and oysters. My favorite band of all time has to be Pink Floyd. In the hip-hop industry, my current favorite musicians are Kendrick Lamar and ASAP Rocky. My favorite color is the color of the sunset. My favorite movie is Pulp Fiction.

What are you afraid of
Seeing a loved one hurt. Only answer I can really come up with.

Is there anything that the Nation does not know about you that you would like them to know
I appreciate every second each and every member spends on this board. It means more to me than they can imagine.

Anything else that you want to add
I love H-N and would do anything for this community. I'd just love to add that anyone can feel free to PM me at any time, whether it's for a forum suggestion, or just a friendly conversation!

Shout outs
Shoutout to Nina and the writing team for these awesome questions.. Shoutout to Roggy and our staff team for holding it down for H-N.. and Shoutout to every user in the Nation! We're the greatest forum on the web!

I tried my best! I did forget stuff about Mike Brown though :-/